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  LiveWire / Teen Forums / Religion & Philosophy / Viewing Topic

Hard Determinism vs. Compatibilism
Purely semantics or just largely?
Replies: 5Last Post June 26 9:32pm by Moridin
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( Wilder )


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Most can agree that at least a very large portion of the hard determinism/ compatibilism debate is semantics, namely a debate over what the functional definition of freedom is. I distinctly remember an article Moridin cited in one of our debates acknowledging as much, and I believe that we ultimately agreed that our dispute was primarily one of semantics. Over the past few days I've wondered if there is any non-semantical difference between the two positions.

Obviously not all compatibilists believe in both determinism and free will, as it is certainly possible to assert that two hypothetical phenomenon would be compatible even if one or both are not real. Those that do accept both, however, seem to believe that man has as much freedom as hard determinists think he does. Both groups acknowledge that the individual makes his or her own choices and that these choices are merely the result of previous conditions. To use the language of my last philosophy class, they all agree that man has the freedom to do as he pleases, but lacks the ability to do otherwise. The only difference, then, is what standard we hold freedom to--is someone free if they make their own choices but ultimately only do so as part of a chain-reaction stemming from things that they cannot control?

Am I missing something, or is the hard determinism/ compatibilism debate entirely semantics?

Please consult google before asking for definitions of terms.

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If you're against hedonism, it's probably because you're not doing it right.


12:18 pm on June 24, 2008 | Joined Dec. 2005 | 746 Days Active
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Apotheosis



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see now, this is a topic worth reading.

12:22 pm on June 24, 2008 | Joined Aug. 2004 | 1000 Days Active
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Both.
Yes it involves semantics, but overall both ideas are compatible in more than one way.

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12:25 pm on June 24, 2008 | Joined May 2007 | 284 Days Active
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Moridin


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I agree that the semantic bottle neck is in regards to concepts such as freedom, identity and what it means for something to be a choice, or an elected action (the term choice is deeply confusing). I liked your statement in that we can want to elect actions, but not elect to want, which is equivalent to your statement.

The only non-semantical issue I can think of right now is that hard determinists argue that the fact that our behavior is cased means that responsibility does not exist, where as comaptibilists argue that the fact that our behavior is cased means that responsibility does, in fact, exist.

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"The larger the island of knowledge, the longer the
shoreline of wonder" (Ralph W. Sockman)


12:28 pm on June 24, 2008 | Joined April 2006 | 500 Days Active
Join to learn more about Moridin Sweden | Asexual Male | 11131 Posts | 17060 Points
( Wilder )


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The only non-semantical issue I can think of right now is that hard determinists argue that the fact that our behavior is cased means that responsibility does not exist, where as comaptibilists argue that the fact that our behavior is cased means that responsibility does, in fact, exist.

That makes sense. I never really looked at the implications past the original assertion, but that does seem to present a relevant distinction.

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If you're against hedonism, it's probably because you're not doing it right.


2:23 pm on June 24, 2008 | Joined Dec. 2005 | 746 Days Active
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Moridin


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Here is an interesting primer on compatibilism:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aC4dXAB7VNI

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"The larger the island of knowledge, the longer the
shoreline of wonder" (Ralph W. Sockman)


9:32 pm on June 26, 2008 | Joined April 2006 | 500 Days Active
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