Don't worry, this will be much shorter than the other thread. I just want to make sure this topic deals with this one issue about the War, and if you want to discuss other things about the War go to my other thread. Again, let's keep this intellectual and respectful. Conversational issue, and a clear partisan divide so it's a rather intense topic. But we can have a great discussion here too.
Again, I'm a republican. Again, I supported the war in 2002, and support it still.
Thus, I support staying in Iraq until the job is done. And I feel the liberal point of view of pulling out would be disastrous. Here are my reasons:
1.) First off, when in military history has a time table been given to their opponent/enemy/adversary? That's recipe for disaster. There's a reason our generals keep battle plans and strategies confidential and top secret. Pulling out, should it come to that, should be no different.
2.) Credibility and Commitment (with respect to our allies)
Learned about this in International Politics last (Freshman) year in college. It was about another event, but I'm applying it to the Iraq war, because the principle obviously hold the same.
If we pull out of Iraq we lose our credibility with our allies. Allies are important because, other than trade and mutual peace, we help each other out in conflicts.
So if we pull out, our allies would see us as weak and that would effect us in the future. They would be less willing to help and get involved if they see we quit. Instead, we need to make sure our allies sees us a dependable partner....
3.) Credibility and Commitment (with respect to ENEMY)
Al-Qaeda, other terrorists groups, and our enemies all around the world would see we are deflatable. They would learn from this of how to beat us. When we use military action again, our enemies know that we don't have enough commitment to see the job through if in troubled times.So they would resist until we give up.
4.) Iraq Chaos
Right now, if you can believe it, Iraq is more stable and less violent overall than when Saddam was in charge. If we stay until we finish the job, Iraq will be 100% stable with a proper government. However, if we leave Iraq becomes more chaotic now, and more chaotic than it ever was under Saddam
No government = anarchy.
Insurgents = violence
Kurds, Shi'ites, Sunni + anarchy = civil war
The cliche phrase is applicable here: If you break it, you bought it. We broke it, we now bought it, and we need to fix it.
How can you possibly justify going into a country -- that was under a brutal regime in the first place -- and leave it even worse off!?
5.) World Wide Security
Not only would the Iraqi's suffer. And not only the US, but the whole world.
Al-Qaeda, who are now in Iraq, would set up a base and be able to reorganize and thus be able to construct plans on the scale of 9/11 and be able to carry out those plans around the world.
6.) Al-Qaeda
Similar to #5. But if we win in Iraq, we essentially defeat Al-Qaeda. Al-Qaeda is a world wide organization, and is now more an ideology, so we they'll still exist. But we completely destroyed them and their base in Afghanistan. But they now have migrated to Iraq. As said in #5, if we pull out Iraq becomes what Afghanistan was, but if we win, AQ are done in the sense of training camps etc
So this war has many level:
US vs. Insurgents
Kurds vs. Sunnis vs. Shi'ites
West vs. AlQaeda
All 3 of these intertwined conflicts themselves alone warrant us not leaving, because us leaving would make all 3 worse.
7.) US Unity/Partisan Divide
Doesn't directly connect with pulling out, but is connected needs to be said
Another true cliche: United we stand, divide we fall
Of course both parties are responsible for the constant fighting, but more so the democrats.
Democrats are being too negative, they level blame, they call our President a liar, they say the war was a mistake etc.
Yes, we have freedom of speech. I'm not saying you CANT say that, I'm not saying we need another Alien and Sedition Act! lol
What I am saying is that, since we're still in war, those negative beliefs are exactly what the terrorists want.
They want to see physical harm, hence they attack us.
But they want us as a society to be divided, but that - as the cliche saying goes - would eventually lead to downfall.
Why be angry at Bush? Be angry at the terrorists who are killing our troops. Realize that Bush isn't killing our troops -- not even indirectly by sending them to war. The terrorists are. If we pull out, the terrorists still exist, and the more killing they will do -- may be more US troops, will def be innocent civilians -- which could be me/you, my/your family, my/your friends etc.
Bus is right when he says "We're fighting them over there so we don't have to fight them here -- at home"
Mistakes, blame, etc should be debated. We don't grow as country unless we learn from our mistakes. But wait until the War is over. We're there now, so you thinking Bush lied to get us there doesnt matter anymore. Unite together, win the war, and then blame and discuss what went wrong, and why it went wrong...
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Conclusion:
While pulling out of Iraq would save more US troops from dying, and we could spend the money saved on important domestic programs such as health care, and such. Pulling out will save us in the short term, but not in the long term (as outlines above).
Staying in Iraq would cost more money and troops and thus would be worse in the short term, but would be worth it in the long run. We will show our desire and credibility, we will crush AQ even further, we'll have one more stable government in the world.....
So while I see why Dems want to pull out. Short term always looks better since it effects us right away. But it would essentially lead to dire consequences.
**THE REAL MISTAKE**
Forgot to mention this, so I'll mention it now.
The biggest mistake is not going all the way in the 1993 Gulf War in
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I agree almost entirely. However, the war costs a lot of money, and our country is in debt.
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