LiveWire Network Peer Answers Peer Support Teen Forums Tech Forums College Forums 680 users online 174530 members 1127 active today Advertise Here Sign In
TeenCollegeTechPhotos | Quizzes | LiveSecret | Video | Dictionary | News | FAQ
You have 1 new message.
Emergency Help
Until you sign up you can't do much. Yes, it's free.

Sign Up Now
Membername:
Password:
Already have an account?
Invite Friends
Active Members
Groups
Contests
Moderators
5 online / 42 MPM
Fresh Topics
  LiveWire / Teen Forums / Religion & Philosophy / Viewing Topic

I think, therefor I am.
Replies: 48Last Post July 5 8:14am by Event Horizon
Pages: 1 2 3 4 Email Print Favorite
Shaknbake


Enlightened One
Reply
Quote: from Mediocre at 7:52 pm on July 1, 2008

It's bullshit because it uses logic, and logic is a property of existence.

WRT Apotheosis, "I think therefore I am" is just a bad translation of "cognito ergo sum," which doesn't include any mention of self at all.


"Cognito," and "sum," are the first person singular forms of "to think" and "to be" in the present tense, no?

Ergo, "Cognito ergo sum" means literally "I think therefore I am." Just because Latin leaves out the pronoun you think the self is not mentioned? It is not a crappy translation in the slightest, and of course it mentions self.

-------
ﻗے؟


9:58 pm on July 2, 2008 | Joined Mar. 2006 | 466 Days Active
Join to learn more about Shaknbake Morocco | Male | 7264 Posts | 14475 Points
Moridin


Omnipotent One

Ad Free
Reply
Quote: from Apotheosis at 3:28 am on July 2, 2008

i'm not saying reality is the offspring of the mind, but that our perception of reality is tied to the mind and that nothing around us may be real

that's a pretty basic philosophical assumption, the notion that shit around us might not be there. descartes tried to answer this by saying "well at least i'm here, because i think", and i'm here telling you that that's stupid because you can think you're here but you're not and don't even exist, not unlike a dissociated personality.

the point is that as long as it's possible for you not to be, you can't say "i think thus i am" without taking a leap of faith, ergo, it's logically flawed. that's not the same as incorrect, just, not a good logical argument. it's a good axiom though, as in, a good thing that we're not sure of but we prefer to assume is true for the purposes of this experiment. namely, life


If nothing around you is real, why are you trying to discuss? If I am nothing more than a figment of your imagination, trying to argue rational presupposes existence.

-------
"The larger the island of knowledge, the longer the
shoreline of wonder" (Ralph W. Sockman)


10:02 pm on July 2, 2008 | Joined April 2006 | 500 Days Active
Join to learn more about Moridin Sweden | Asexual Male | 11131 Posts | 17060 Points
Apotheosis



Patron
Reply
i don't think you are, but you could be.

and if cogito ergo sum requires self then it's more of an issue for me because identity has to be involved somehow


4:30 am on July 3, 2008 | Joined Aug. 2004 | 1000 Days Active
Join to learn more about Apotheosis Venezuela | 20486 Posts | 32809 Points
Event Horizon


Dairy Product Addict
Reply
Quote: from Apotheosis at 4:30 am on July 3, 2008

i don't think you are, but you could be.

and if cogito ergo sum requires self then it's more of an issue for me because identity has to be involved somehow


As long as something exists to think, that something must have a self, whatever that self is.
I can not think in the first person third person [thinking "I" for someone else]

As long as there is thought, there is something to think it; as long as there is something to think it, there is self.

-------
Life is pleasant. Death is peaceful.It's the transition
that's troublesome.
  --Isaac Asimov


8:14 am on July 5, 2008 | Joined May 2008 | 87 Days Active
Join to learn more about Event Horizon New York, United States | Straight Male | 864 Posts | 1851 Points
Pages: 1 2 3 4 Email Print Favorite

Quick Reply

You are signed in as our guest.

Looking for something else?
 

  LiveWire / Teen Forums / Religion & Philosophy / Viewing Topic