Would you support a socioeconomic based affirmative action?  Or do you believe that a socioeconomic based affirmative action does not answer the needs of minorities and thus a race based affirmative action must remain?  Or perhaps a mixture of the two or neither at all?

I think socio-economic based is more importat though. I think they really just should have started with the socio- economic .

It would have taken care of everybody who needs the most.

Post edited at 2:31 pm on Aug. 6, 2008 by jakelong

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"Everyone helpin' each other whenever they can we makin' it happen, from nothin' to somethin'
That's how we be survivin'" - BEP

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How would the two be mixed?

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By giving the benefits of AA to all peoples of the working class, however, also giving greater preference to racial minorities.  Essentially, all working class people would get a boost, but the working class racial minorities would be getting the greatest boost.

Quote: from The Artful Dodger at 10:04 am on Aug. 6, 2008

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Socio-economic...it'll still prolly end up helping the same people anyway. But yeah, white people should get cut in too. It's only fair.

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Oh, I don't know about it helping the "same" people.  Racial minority groups tend to be poorer as a total percentage of their population, but there are certainly tons of poor whites.  Visiting any lower class area from time to time shows you this.  And in general, the poor whites tend to get screwed over by a race base AA pretty badly - though not as badly as East Asians.

Quote: from Cuddlefish at 12:26 am on Aug. 6, 2008

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I'd like to be picked for a job, not based on my race or socioeconomic status, but because I am truly conscientious, trustworthy and diligent. Ideas like affirmative action just reinforce ignorance among "minorities" to be dependent upon the Government and their excellent initiatives, rather than striving for more.

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This is what I'd answer.  The government is not and should not be the solution to domestic issues.  Self-sufficiency, as Sudo talked about, is what should be strived for, despite whatever barriers there may be, and if successful, such stereotypes and barriers wind up being displaced over time.

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Racial minority groups tend to be poorer as a total percentage of their population, but there are certainly tons of poor whites.

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Prolly they thought helping ALL poor ppl was communism so they was scared to do it?

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"Everyone helpin' each other whenever they can we makin' it happen, from nothin' to somethin'
That's how we be survivin'" - BEP

As far as the notion that we should get rid of all of it, and that people should simply pull themselves up by their bootstraps...you people have just never been unlucky, have you. The arrogance.

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"If god hates anyone based on what they prefer...
then god himself is a loser.... and should GTFO...." - ijustdontknow

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Prolly they thought helping ALL poor ppl was communism so they was scared to do it?

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Nah, I doubt it.  What really started it was the entire notion of "white privilege," and race based affirmative action was to be used to correct this and put minorities on equal footing.  It was first established in the early 60s and became more widespread in the US after that.  Proponents of race based affirmative action often claim that subconscious racism (which feeds into white privilege) is as strong as it's always been, thus the need to keep it.  Supposedly this would help minorities get the positions they need in the work force and get on equal footing with whites.  This, of course, never happened (with the exception of East Asians, who seem to be in their socioeconomic position for reasons other than simply AA, especially now that AA as it is right now hurts East Asians the most) because affirmative action doesn't really fix anything, but rather, treats the symptoms of the problem.  Much like taking a cold pill when you have a cold - makes you feel a little better, but fixes nothing until the cold fixes itself.

A socioeconomic based affirmative action then, under the logic of those who promote race based affirmative action, would only truly benefit poor whites and not poor minorities.  However, to be able to agree with these people, you need to believe that subconscious racism is as strong as it has always been, as well as think that affirmative action will actually fix the problems minorities face socioeconomically in the long term.  Moreover, you also need to believe that the minorities that are poor are poor simply due to racism alone.  I personally think there's a lot more to it than just one simple reason alone.

Quote: from Krelian393 at 11:30 pm on Aug. 6, 2008

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As far as the notion that we should get rid of all of it, and that people should simply pull themselves up by their bootstraps...you people have just never been unlucky, have you. The arrogance.

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So you believe that the people who think that any kind of affirmative action should be abolished have never been poor or faced any difficult financial situation?  And you're calling us arrogant?

Post edited at 12:59 am on Aug. 7, 2008 by Bud2400

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Quote: from jakelong at 5:03 pm on Aug. 6, 2008

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Prolly they thought helping ALL poor ppl was communism so they was scared to do it?

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Nah, I doubt it. What really started it was the entire notion of "white privilege," and race based affirmative action was to be used to correct this and put minorities on equal footing. It was first established in the early 60s and became more widespread in the US after that. Proponents of race based affirmative action often claim that subconscious racism (which feeds into white privilege) is as strong as it's always been, thus the need to keep it. Supposedly this would help minorities get the positions they need in the work force and get on equal footing with whites. This, of course, never happened (with the exception of East Asians, who seem to be in their socioeconomic position for reasons other than simply AA, especially now that AA as it is right now hurts East Asians the most) because affirmative action doesn't really fix anything, but rather, treats the symptoms of the problem. Much like taking a cold pill when you have a cold - makes you feel a little better, but fixes nothing until the cold fixes itself.

A socioeconomic based affirmative action then, under the logic of those who promote race based affirmative action, would only truly benefit poor whites and not poor minorities. However, to be able to agree with these people, you need to believe that subconscious racism is as strong as it has always been, as well as think that affirmative action will actually fix the problems minorities face socioeconomically in the long term. Moreover, you also need to believe that the minorities that are poor are poor simply due to racism alone. I personally think there's a lot more to it than just one simple reason alone.

 
Quote: from Krelian393 at 11:30 pm on Aug. 6, 2008

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As far as the notion that we should get rid of all of it, and that people should simply pull themselves up by their bootstraps...you people have just never been unlucky, have you. The arrogance.

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So you believe that the people who think that any kind of affirmative action should be abolished have never been poor or faced any difficult financial situation? And you're calling us arrogant?

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If not arrogant, then perhaps you've got a selective memory?

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"If god hates anyone based on what they prefer...
then god himself is a loser.... and should GTFO...." - ijustdontknow

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im confused

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same

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~Ill cool your ass down if you think your hot shit~