Really, though, if you want foolproof evidence of the gassings of Jews and all that, why not get some soil samples? I would honestly doubt that the governments of Germany and Poland would prohibit it simply because there is already "evidence." You'd think if it supported the story they're trying to push, they would use it as evidence, wouldn't you? Is there any real reason not to take some soil samples?

Post edited at 6:24 pm on Dec. 4, 2008 by Bud2400

I'm not sure where this "there's no residue" argument has sprung from, I've certainly never heard of it until now. On the face of it it seems fairly retarded.

Very briefly, because I'm short of time, the evidence in this area is quite compelling. We know that Nazi politics and science lead them to racial studies, racism and eugenics. There are plenty of documents that discuss these things, including using internees as scientific guinea pigs (for example). We know about Zyklon B and other gas manufacture from documents and witnesses, we know about internment camp infrastructure from the same (as well as photos largely taken by Soviet and American troops).

We know that the organised killing of internees didn't begin until the later stages of the short history of Nazi Germany, and this also fits with the pyschology of the leadership and politics of the time. This is reflected in letters and diaries and also the changing government policy.

I would go as far to say that by the time WW2 began if the Nazis hadn't stepped up interning undesirables and began to systematically kill them off I would be surprised, everything about the Nazis had suggested this as an end point.

Does anyone here actually know anything the history of Nazi Germany politics and society? If you do, do you recall Schacht/Goerring debates, or the nature of Hitler's leadership style, or war and social policy debates, any of this stuff? Does anything about this suggest that the Nazis would suddenly stop the gradual decline towards the holocaust?

-------
Massive, epic adventure, multi-coloured, multi-layered.
Sort of two/three dimensional Wizard of Oz for the future.

---

You mean evidence. And yes, there's plenty of evidence, all the usual historiographic shit: documents, people, photos, diaries, politics.

---

---

It seems as if you often switch between arguing that the holocaust didn't happen and that it did happen but not to the accepted scale. Which is it?

---

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Firstly, no where near 6 million people were gassed. It's quite amusing this goes to show how little you actually know about a topic you often talk about.

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Secondly, it isn't reasonable to believe that (a) someone took a photo of someone being gassed, (b) the photo still exists today and (c) the photo is available to us.

---

The whole gassing concept is void of much proof.

I have theories that may actually make it psychologically true that there were gassings.

Plenty of "Sources" are people that never saw people getting gassed and only heard of it from Kapos - the Jews in charge of prisoners.

It kind of looks like stories Kapos used to scare Jews psychologically to bring order in the camp.

Then after the war they took their claims and ran with it - and the Jews would actually tell about it - and not lie to themselves (Because they really didn't know the truth).

They may have said it to make the Germans feel bad or to get money - or maybe it slipped out and all the other inmates came out and said "Yeah, I heard that!" or "My brother was gassed!" or other insane stories.

The Soviets, British, and Americans were pissed at the Germans at wars end - they had nothing better to do than believe those stories - why else would they starve the Germans and hand them over to death camps or slavery in the USSR - many times the Germans committing suicide so they wouldn't have to go throught that.

Funny thing that there aren't too many records of Jews committing suicide before they went to the labor - I mean death - camps.

-------
"One of the Germans... would frequently snatch a child from the
woman's arms and... tear the child in half... Such incidents...
occurred all the time." - A Year in Treblinka, Yankel Wiernik,
Treblinka's "most authoritative eyewitness"

---

How can you deny the Holocaust when the events that led to it were obvious?

I have heard deniers say there was no proof.

All I can say is are you kidding me?

Hitler did not Like the Jewish, he turned Germany vastly Anti Semitical, what does an Anti Semitical state do?

You know possibly like, Exterminate the Jews?

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who cares?  lol

it's freedom of expression.  people should be allowed to say ANYTHING!! lol

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You realise that the Soviets and Americans destroyed most, if not all, the Nazi internment camps years ago, right?

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---

I'm not sure where this "there's no residue" argument has sprung from, I've certainly never heard of it until now. On the face of it it seems fairly retarded.

---

---

Very briefly, because I'm short of time, the evidence in this area is quite compelling. We know that Nazi politics and science lead them to racial studies, racism and eugenics. There are plenty of documents that discuss these things, including using internees as scientific guinea pigs (for example). We know about Zyklon B and other gas manufacture from documents and witnesses, we know about internment camp infrastructure from the same (as well as photos largely taken by Soviet and American troops).

---

Why else would Hitler try to create a Jewish state in Madagascar?

Scientific guinea pigs? Give me a break. I've heard claims that he killed them all with his experiments - how did they survive?

And we know about Zyclon-B.
I'm not denying that it came into Auschwitz.

But it was for DELOUSING. It was the main pesticide of the day.

There was a lot of lice - which explains the mounds of hair - that brought typhus - explaining the mounds of emaciated bodies - among the people of that day.
The SS soldiers were dying of typhus too!

And those photos show no signs of mass murder at all.
Yes, I've seen them.

-------
"One of the Germans... would frequently snatch a child from the
woman's arms and... tear the child in half... Such incidents...
occurred all the time." - A Year in Treblinka, Yankel Wiernik,
Treblinka's "most authoritative eyewitness"

---

Credibility is also a factor in this - greatly reducing the expanse of the so called evidence.

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No shit. But you choose to continue to question this even after pretty much every historian who's studied it said it largely is reliable. What more do you want?

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Of course 6 million weren't gassed!

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No shit Sherlock. Gassing is pretty inefficient.

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Well you can bet your ass the photo WOULD be available to you. It WOULD be used as proof.

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By availble I also was referring to it being lost or unidentified. But yes, you're probably right.

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The whole gassing concept is void of much proof.

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There is plenty of evidence that points toward Nazi gas chambers.

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Plenty of "Sources" are people that never saw people getting gassed and only heard of it from Kapos - the Jews in charge of prisoners.

It kind of looks like stories Kapos used to scare Jews psychologically to bring order in the camp.

Then after the war they took their claims and ran with it - and the Jews would actually tell about it - and not lie to themselves (Because they really didn't know the truth).

They may have said it to make the Germans feel bad or to get money - or maybe it slipped out and all the other inmates came out and said "Yeah, I heard that!" or "My brother was gassed!" or other insane stories.

The Soviets, British, and Americans were pissed at the Germans at wars end - they had nothing better to do than believe those stories - why else would they starve the Germans and hand them over to death camps or slavery in the USSR - many times the Germans committing suicide so they wouldn't have to go throught that.

Funny thing that there aren't too many records of Jews committing suicide before they went to the labor - I mean death - camps.

---

Compared to this conjecture the evidence supporting gas chambers this is extremely solid.

-------
Massive, epic adventure, multi-coloured, multi-layered.
Sort of two/three dimensional Wizard of Oz for the future.

---

No shit. But you choose to continue to question this even after pretty much every historian who's studied it said it largely is reliable. What more do you want?

---

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No shit Sherlock. Gassing is pretty inefficient.

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There is plenty of evidence that points toward Nazi gas chambers.

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Compared to this conjecture the evidence supporting gas chambers this is extremely solid.

---

Eyewitness accounts aren't too valid either - before you use them.

-------
"One of the Germans... would frequently snatch a child from the
woman's arms and... tear the child in half... Such incidents...
occurred all the time." - A Year in Treblinka, Yankel Wiernik,
Treblinka's "most authoritative eyewitness"

I'm not about to argue what did and did not happen, it's dull. Suffice to say my original point: if you think that eye witness testimonies, documents, diaries, photos, politics etc. are not sufficient evidence then there are many things you must not accept as historically valid. The moon landings spring to mind: photos were faked, testimonies invented for personal gain, the usual bullshit that is both boring and shows poor historiography.

-------
Massive, epic adventure, multi-coloured, multi-layered.
Sort of two/three dimensional Wizard of Oz for the future.

---

Quote: from kidd rune at 2:39 am on Dec. 5, 2008

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Credibility is also a factor in this - greatly reducing the expanse of the so called evidence.

---

No shit. But you choose to continue to question this even after pretty much every historian who's studied it said it largely is reliable. What more do you want?

---

How many scientists were out there confirming beyond a doubt that the Earth was the center of the universe back when the Church was executing anyone who said other wise?


-------
whoisabs i'm not sure
Guess who's back?

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You realise that the Soviets and Americans destroyed most, if not all, the Nazi internment camps years ago, right?

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Of course, but their destruction of them isn't proof in and of itself.

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I'm not sure where this "there's no residue" argument has sprung from, I've certainly never heard of it until now. On the face of it it seems fairly retarded.

---

Why would it seem retarded?

---

Very briefly, because I'm short of time, the evidence in this area is quite compelling. We know that Nazi politics and science lead them to racial studies, racism and eugenics. There are plenty of documents that discuss these things, including using internees as scientific guinea pigs (for example). We know about Zyklon B and other gas manufacture from documents and witnesses, we know about internment camp infrastructure from the same (as well as photos largely taken by Soviet and American troops).

---

I see your argument - you can't look at the evidence one piece at a time because those small little pieces aren't damning by themselves, but putting it altogether, it is and suggests something very fishy was going on.

And you know, I'm inclined to agree with you here.  You can't escape from the holistic approach.  But having studied a bit of Nazi racial theory, I've seen nothing that advocates the deaths of all Jews.  They say largely the same crap you find on Stormfront - that Jews are the parasites of society, cunning yet cowardly, a danger to society, etc.  This is why the internment of the Jews was deemed necessary by Nazi leadership during the war, and why they requested their allies send their Jews to their camps to be interned as well.

Still, though, I see nothing suggesting the killing of all Jews.  I know about Joseph Mengele's experiments on Jews and they don't surprise me - the Nazis had a tendency to disregard ethics for what was deemed as the greater good.  Thing about the idea of the Nazi intent to kill all Jews is that it was never deemed as a desireable goal - the ideal was to simply expel the Jews to some place a ways away that wasn't Palestine.

---

We know that the organised killing of internees didn't begin until the later stages of the short history of Nazi Germany, and this also fits with the pyschology of the leadership and politics of the time. This is reflected in letters and diaries and also the changing government policy.

---

The earliest I've heard was 1942, latest was 1943.  I wouldn't call the situation in Germany truly "desperate," in the sense that defeat was coming and that the nation was on the verge of collapse, until after the Battle of Kursk in summer 1943.  But regardless of how desperate the Nazis were, I still see no evidence to their desire to kill all Jews.  Most people point to the Wannsee Protocol, but that only suggests such if you interpret it already believing of the Nazi intent to kill all Jews.

Why would they suddenly kill Jews now and not before?  Would their slave labor not be more useful?  And how does this not contradict the death marches back to Germany?  You'd think if they wanted all Jews dead, they'd just blow them all up at Auchswitz or shoot every last one dead prior to the march, and rush those SS soldiers back to prepare for the final stand instead of "escorting" all those Jews back to Germany.

---

Does anyone here actually know anything the history of Nazi Germany politics and society? If you do, do you recall Schacht/Goerring debates, or the nature of Hitler's leadership style, or war and social policy debates, any of this stuff? Does anything about this suggest that the Nazis would suddenly stop the gradual decline towards the holocaust?

---

I've read William L. Shirer's book "The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich," plus a few other random sources that I can't remember off the top of my head.  Personally, I think the Jews during the holocaust were treated like shit (really, it's kinda hard to deny this point - I can't imagine abuse and rape was unheard of), and as such, the holocaust could still be said to be a genocide without the Nazi intent to kill all Jews or the gas chambers.  I get the sense that millions died, especially during the final year when the situation was desperate (leading to poor food rationing, pushing their slave labor extra hard to the point of exhaustion, which also led to many succumbing to diseases on a larger scale, etc.), but I have doubts about how the number 6 million is reached.

But that is mainly just conjecture.  From all I've read, I still see holes and inconsistencies in the "official" story, hence why I'm still skeptical.

And I'm telling you, getting those soil samples would be the best and foolproof way to get that evidence, but nobody seems to want to address this point.  It's one thing to just criticize and criticize, and then claim that there's nothing else there left to be tested so that makes them right, but it's another to criticize and criticize, and then suggest something new that the governments of Germany and Poland are refusing to allow and withholding any real judgment until that is collected and tested.

Post edited at 7:24 pm on Dec. 4, 2008 by Bud2400

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I've seen no reliable evidence that concludes that it was.

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1. On Crematoriums

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On October 22, 1941, more than six months before the outbreak of the typhus epidemic, the Bauleitung sent a letter to Topf and Sons, builder of the Auschwitz ovens. The letter referred to a previous conversation between the head of the Bauleitung and a representative of Topf and Sons. It informed Topf that the Bauleitung was ordering five triple muffle furnaces, or 15 ovens. The order is also referred to in two subsequent letters of March 5 and March 30, 1942. [46] At the time Auschwitz had four ovens and another double muffle furnace was being built. Therefore, the authorities had six ovens.

Why did the authorities decide to increase the camp's cremation capacity by 3 1/2 times (from 6 to 21 ovens) when there was no major epidemic in the camp? The answer lies in other events of October 1941, the month that the order was first placed. For the period October 7 to 31 the Auschwitz morgue registries - not to be confused with the Auschwitz Death Books - show 1255 deaths of Soviet Prisoners of War. For the period from October 1941 through January 1942 the morgue registries record the deaths of 7343 Soviet POWs of the 9997 brought into the camp, an astounding 73% mortality rate over a four month period. [47] The Auschwitz authorities had plans to greatly expand the population of the camp to 125,000

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Remember this was BEFORE any typhus outbreak and BEFORE the US/Soviet entry into Poland.

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There is also substantial evidence that non-Soviet prisoners were being murdered en masse. The Auschwitz Death Books, though mostly incomplete, provide useful information in this regard. They show that from August 4 to September 10, 1941, 1498 registered prisoners died. An additional 1490 died from October 21 to November 22, 1941. [49] Although there are two death books missing for this period, as was noted earlier each death book carries between 1400 and 1500 names. This means that about 6,000 non-Soviet prisoners died in the five month period from August to December 1941. [50] Although the total number of prisoners registered in Auschwitz in 1941 is not known, camp records for January 19, 1942 show a total of 11,703 registered prisoners, which includes 1510 Soviet POWs. [51] This means that in the last five months of 1941 more prisoners died than were registered at the beginning of 1942. Camp documents show that of the 36, 285 prisoners who were known to have been in Auschwitz from May 20, 1940 to January 31, 1942, 20,565 cannot be accounted for. [52]

In November 1941, the Polish Government in Exile reported, based on information received from the Polish underground, that "[d]uring the winter months, the crematoria ovens have not sufficed for burning all the corpses." [53] Consequently, the origins of the new crematoria can be traced to mass murder.

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The term "special action" was mentioned 14 times in a diary kept by Auschwitz doctor Johann Kremer for the period from September through November 1942. [56] The diary was seized by the arresting authorities. In his 1947 trial Kremer testified that the special actions referred to gassing prisoners. "These mass murders took place in small cottages situated outside the Birkenau camp in a wood."  [57] Kremer gave similar testimony at the Auschwitz trials in the mid-1960s where he was not a defendant.

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2. On Gassing

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"Vergasungskeller"
This letter of January 29, 1943 was written by SS-Hauptsturmführer (Captain) Karl Bischoff to SS-Oberführer (Sr. Colonel) Hans Kammler concerning the progress made on Krematorium II.

In this letter, the word "Vergasungskeller" is used to describe the supposed "morgue." That word means exactly what it sounds like: "gassing cellar," a (homicidal) gas chamber. This was a slip which not only proves that there was a gas chamber in Krema II, but that the architect Bischoff knew exactly what he was constructing.

Transcription:

Das Krematorium II wurde unter Einsatz aller verfügbaren Kräfte trotz unsagbarer Schwierigkeiten und Frostwetter bei Tag- und Nachbetrieb [sic] bis auf bauliche Kleinigkeiten fertiggestellt. Die Öfen wurden im Beisein des Herrn Oberingenieur Prüfer der ausführenden Firma, Firma Topf u. Söhne, Erfurt, angefeuert und funtionieren [sic] tadellos. Die Eisenbetondecke des Leichenkellers konnte infolge Frosteinwirkung noch nicht ausgeschalt werden. Die [sic] ist jedoch unbedeutend, da der Vergasungskeller hierfür benützt werden kann.

Die Firma Topf u. Soehne konnte infolge Waggonsperre die Be- und Entlüftungsanlage nicht wie von der Zentralbauleitung gefordert rechtzeitig anliefern. Nach Eintreffen der Be- und Entlüftungsanlage wird jedoch mit dem Einbau sofort begonnen, sodass voraussichtlich am 20.2.43 die Anlage vollständig betriebsfertig ist.

Ein Bericht des Prüfingenieurs der Firma Topf u. Söhne wird beigelegt.

Translation:

Except for some minor construction work, Krematorium II was finished by working with all our available forces day and night, despite inexpressible difficulties and freezing weather. The ovens were fired in the presence of the senior engineer Prüfer of the executing firm, Topf and Sons, Erfurt, and they are working faultlessly. The reinforced concrete ceiling of the morgue could not yet be eliminated due to the freezing weather. However, this is not significant, as the gassing cellar can be used for this purpose.

Due to the railway car prohibition, the company Topf and Sons could not deliver the aeration and deaeration equipment at the time demanded by the Zentralbauleitung. After the aeration and deaeration equipment arrive, however, installation will begin immediately, so that presumably by February 20, 1943, it will be completely ready for operation.

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http://www.holocaust-history.org/auschwitz/19430129-vergasungskeller/

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"Bathing Installations for Special Action"
This report of August 21, 1942, describes the installation of two large ovens in the "bathing installations for special action." The Nazi phrase "special action" was a code-word for murder. The phrase "bathing installations" was a euphemism for the gas chambers.

Transcription:

2.) Bezüglich Aufstellung von je 2 Dreimuffelöfen bei den "Badeanstalten für Sonderaktionen" wurden von Ing. Prüfer vorgeschlagen, die Öfen aus einen bereits fertiggestellten Lieferung nach Mogilev abzuzweigen und wurde sogleich der Dienststellenleiter welcher beim SS-Wirtschaftsverwaltungshauptamt in Berlin anwesend war, hiervon tel. in Kenntnis gesetzt und gebeten das weitere veranlassen zu wollen.

Translation:

2.) Relative to the setting up of two three-muffle ovens at the "bathing installations for special actions," engineer Prüfer recommended to separate the ovens out of an already-completed shipment to Mogliev, and wanted to immediately inform the agency leader who was present at the SS Economic Administration Main Office of this by telephone, and to ask that further arrangements be made.

---

http://www.holocaust-history.org/auschwitz/19420821-badeanstalten/

Can anyone tell me what "bathing" would have to do with crematorium oven? Are we talking about turkeys here?

Here is an answer

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.At the top left, we see the building being inventoried, "Krematorium III," also known as "KGL 30a." Below that, the first room listed ("Raum 1") has been written in as "Leichenkeller 1," which literally means "morgue 1." This is the homicidal gassing chamber.

At the far right, we see that there are the categories of "Brausen" (showers, showerheads) and the written-in inventory item "Gasdichtetur" (gas-tight door). We see that Leichenkeller 1 has 14 showerheads and a gas-tight door.

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Can anyone explain to me why regular showers would need a gastight door?

3. On some soil samples.

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Is there any real reason not to take some soil samples?

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Here's some info on the soil sample issue.

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Deniers have sought to capitalize on Leuchter's errors and ignorance of Auschwitz. They can do this because many people don't have the technical expertise on these issues to challenge Leuchter's credibility. However, in 1994 the Institute for Forensic Research in Cracow, Poland undertook a comprehensive examination of the structures identified by numerous eye witnesses as homicidal gas chambers. The Institute found traces of hydrocyanic acid in the six structures it tested. These were the remains of five crematoria and an execution block. Most disturbing for deniers is that the   Institute found the greatest concentration of poison gas in the samples it tested from Crematorium II. Six of its seven samples tested positive.  [7]

By contrast, Leuchter claimed that he could not find any hydrocyanic acid in this structure. [8] This proved that Leuchter was either totally incompetent at best or dishonest at worst. The Institute's findings in Crematorium II also substantiated an earlier observation by denier critic Jean Claude Pressac, who viewed a tape of Leuchter's sample gathering, that Leuchter had purposely avoided those areas of Crematorium II which would yield positive results. [9] It may be relevant here that the Institute had the ability to take samples from places likely to collect residue, whereas even had Leuchter been honest, he could not do so as his collecting was done illegally because he lacked permission to gather samples.

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http://www.holocaust-history.org/auschwitz/body-disposal/

Hope that helps.

I have question though.

What do people think is "reliable evidence"? Is the evidence given above "enough"? Or should it be dismissed because it does not come from a denier site? Or do we need more to really convince? Why is it the standard for proving the Holocaust way much higher than for any other genocide?


-------
"Everyone helpin' each other whenever they can we makin' it happen, from nothin' to somethin'
That's how we be survivin'" - BEP

---

We want to emphasize that cyanide traces were found in the remains of Birkenau's extermination facilities, proving that cyanide was used there. Therefore, any speculations about whether or not Zyklon-B  could be used for mass murder are purely academic.  The traces were   there, so cyanide was most certainly used in these rooms

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Here is the chemistry for Prussian Blue

---

III.  Prussian Blue:  What is it?

     Prussian blue is a sparingly soluble salt made of three   molecules of iron (II) hexacyanate ion bound to four molecules of  iron (III) {9}.  The complex can be formed under  acidic conditions with a solution of FeSO4 and cyanide ion:

       Fe+2   +    6CN-1  ---->   [Fe(CN)6]-4

       4Fe+3  +   3[Fe(CN)6]-4  ---->  Fe4[Fe(CN)6]3                          
                                prussian blue

     Note that numbers with a + or - sign denote charge, while those without signs are stoichiometric coefficients.   The sulfate ion  cancels out, as it is not involved in the reaction.  The cyanide   ion could be provided by a completely soluble salt like potassium

  cyanide (KCN) or in equilibrium with the acid form (HCN).  Note  that the counter ions for cyanide (K+ or H+) will drop out of the  equation as well.
       
     Prussian blue is not very soluble, with a calculated solubility  constant of Ka = 10^-84.5 {10}.  Its solubility is highly pH dependent, and it is least soluble at a moderately acidic pH of   about 2 - 6 units. It becomes increasingly soluble above a pH of  4.0 {11}.

 
  IV.  Kinetics of Iron (II) Hexacyanate Formation.

Iron (II) hexacyanate is a precursor for prussian blue  formation, and the complex will not form without it.  It forms in  a stepwise fashion, meaning that cyanide ions become complexed to  the iron one at a time:

     Iron (II) Hexacyanate Formation

        Fe+2  + CN-1 --->  FeCN+1
       
        FeCN+1  + CN-1 ---->  Fe(CN)2

        Fe(CN)2  + CN-1  --->    [Fe(CN)3]-1
               
        [Fe(CN)3]-1  +  CN-1  ----->   [Fe(CN)4]-2

        [Fe(CN)4]-2 +  CN-1  ----->   [Fe(CN)5]-3

        [Fe(CN)5]-3  +   CN-1  ----->  [Fe(CN)6]-4

     Note that the final product of this reaction is not prussian  blue , it is merely the water soluble iron-cyanide complex that
  combines with more iron to form prussian blue.
This product is absolutely required to make prussian blue.

     This last step is very slow and determines the overall reaction  rate {12}.  It is so slow that the reaction to produce iron (II)   hexacyanate can take upwards of 30 hours to complete when
  FeSO4*7H20 and KCN are mixed together {13}.  

Since the production    of prussian blue depends on iron (II) hexacyanate,  prussian blue   formation will be equally slow.

This means that a very short time  of exposure to cyanide will not produce very much prussian blue at all.

---

You guys can study all the gory details here

http://www.nizkor.org/ftp.cgi/camps/auschwitz/ftp.py?camps/auschwitz//cyanide/cyanide.002

I feel I'm doing some AP chem homework frankly. But lets see if the deniers/doubters are satisfied...

-------
"Everyone helpin' each other whenever they can we makin' it happen, from nothin' to somethin'
That's how we be survivin'" - BEP

---

Just curious why exactly do you want a picture of a person in the process of being gassed as proof? You do realize that there were no windows to the chambers and no way is a troop going to be inside the chambers to take a picture while the people are being gassed.

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And about the gassing letter:
http://www.fpp.co.uk/Letters/Auschwitz/Dunkus170203.html" target="_top">http://http://www.fpp.co.uk/Letters/Auschwitz/Dunkus170203.html

---

What do people think is "reliable evidence"? Is the evidence given above "enough"? Or should it be dismissed because it does not come from a denier site? Or do we need more to really convince? Why is it the standard for proving the Holocaust way much higher than for any other genocide?

---

But why do they only let GOVERNMENT FUNDED (The same government that makes it ILLEGAL to deny) people test it?
The past few people that have tested it came out negative by the way.

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Can anyone explain to me why regular showers would need a gastight door?

---

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No there's no reason not to and it WAS done.

Here's some info on the soil sample issue.
....

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And I saw the results of the soil sample - and it was quite odd.

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Lamprecht
http://www.hotlism.net/imagehost/images/ox71290kfclcjnkb27v.gif
Lamprecht
http://www.hotlism.net/imagehost/images/ytpnq7wykalm85arivfc.gif
Lamprecht
first is the map drawn by the us ground tester
Lamprecht
on the dead bodies
Lamprecht
2nd is better quality of it
Lamprecht
http://www.hotlism.net/imagehost/images/dumx7j5dj8kby8ej787.gif
Lamprecht
that's the arad version
Lamprecht
Yitzhak Arad
Lamprecht
the guy that made all the holocaust books that are the source of everything
Lamprecht
http://www.hotlism.net/imagehost/images/cc7jgnzoktsykn1ql0i9.gif
Lamprecht
here's my intake

---

Jakey - tell me why if I try to test the walls or dig up the dead bodies I'll get put in jail for years?

What are they hiding?

Why can I deny the death of over 100 million people due to communism - but not 6 million Jews?

-------
"One of the Germans... would frequently snatch a child from the
woman's arms and... tear the child in half... Such incidents...
occurred all the time." - A Year in Treblinka, Yankel Wiernik,
Treblinka's "most authoritative eyewitness"

---

And about the gassing letter:  

---

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Well that one letter I knew for a fact that it was a fake - just like many of the other letters and quotations.

---

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But why do they only let GOVERNMENT FUNDED people test it?

---

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(The same government that makes it ILLEGAL to deny)

---

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The past few people that have tested it came out negative by the way.

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Here:

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But let's read the text

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Disinfection Station

For the disinfection of the prisoners' clothing in the several parts of BA [Bauabschnitt: i.e., Birkenau sector -- ed.] II an Organization Todt disinfection station is envisioned. In order to achieve a complete bodily delousing for the prisoners, both of the existing baths for prisoners in BA I will be equipped with hot water heaters and boilers, so that there will be hot water for the existing showers. It is further planned to run heating pipes from the incinerator at crematorium III, to be used for the water in the showers to be set up in one of the basements of crematorium III.

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Does NOT explain the need of gastight doors.

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On June 5, 1942, Topf sent Drawing D60446 to the Zentralbauleitung "regarding the installation of the boilers in the rubbish incinerator." This project also involved the installations for crematorium II. In an undated "questionnaire" apparently written in June 1943 regarding the Birkenau crematoriums, in answer to the question "Are the exhaust gases utilized?," the head of the Zentralbauleitung, Bischoff, responded: "Planned but not carried out," and in response to the following question: "If yes, to what purpose?," Bischoff answered, "for bath facilities in crematorium II and III."[see note]

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Why did they find bodies and skeleton in the "rubbish incinerators"? And why do we need exhaust gases in a shower?

Stll does not explain the need of a gastight door.

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And I saw the results of the soil sample - and it was quite odd.

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Why can I deny the death of over 100 million people due to communism - but not 6 million Jews?

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Austria, Belgium, Czech Republic, France, Germany, Israel, Liechtenstein, Lithuania, Luxembourg, Poland, Portugal, Romania, and Switzerland.  

What is the present Jewish population in Germany, Austria Czech republic, Belgium Luxembourg?

Here is the answer

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_population

Do you think it is
1. A jewish conspiracy?
2. All the leaders in those countries are Jewish
3. A jew-lover fest in Europe?  
4. Maybe those guys are getting sick and tired of the deniers going on and on about it because they had to endure it for 50 years?

Anyway I bet they will repeal the law one day because it creates more deniers than solves anything really.

BTW funny I had no idea you and Bud2400 are MSN buddies. Are you also buddies with abs?

Post edited at 6:08 am on Dec. 6, 2008 by jakelong

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"Everyone helpin' each other whenever they can we makin' it happen, from nothin' to somethin'
That's how we be survivin'" - BEP