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Quote: from Event Horizon at 8:19 pm on July 5, 2009

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Quote: from Cunning Stunt at 10:39 pm on July 5, 2009

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Quote: from Descartes at 10:38 pm on July 5, 2009

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Hmm, I'll have to give it a look. Maybe it will be the thing to push me over the line haha.

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There's a part in The God Delusion where he pretty much says that agnostics are people who are too afraid to take a firm stance either way.

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He also chastises people who make decisions without absolute evidence, and yet does just that. As humans we, in fact, have NO IDEA WHAT IS GOING ON in the universe. While it may be the case that the idea of God is not the most logical, showing the inconsistencies in religious ideologies hardly proves that no god exists, and, even if that is the case, standing on a soap box and preaching that no god exists is just as immature as preaching that god does.    

I can't see how one could find a more logical stance than "we don't know what the fuck is up"

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Where does he do that? Chapter and Verse please. Also we actually have a pretty good picture of what is going on in the universe, not perfect by any means but we aren't totally clueless.

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We are fucking clueless.

edit: The ancients were just as convinced that they were right; silly them, eh?

Post edited at 8:34 pm on July 5, 2009 by Event Horizon

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Life is pleasant. Death is peaceful.It's the transition
that's troublesome.   --Isaac Asimov

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Quote: from Event Horizon at 7:04 pm on July 5, 2009

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Quote: from Descartes at 10:02 pm on July 5, 2009

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I am agnostic...stating to lean towards atheism though :/

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lean as you will. Neither is a better position.

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The only piece of literature that keeps me from being an atheist is Thomas Aquinas's "The Five Ways"

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Quote: from Descartes at 8:07 pm on July 5, 2009

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Quote: from Event Horizon at 7:04 pm on July 5, 2009

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Quote: from Descartes at 10:02 pm on July 5, 2009

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I am agnostic...stating to lean towards atheism though :/

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 lean as you will. Neither is a better position.

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 The only piece of literature that keeps me from being an atheist is Thomas Aquinas's "The Five Ways"

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You must be joking... his reasoning, while certainly not the worst I've heard, is still fairly weak.

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I dont use everything he presents exactly as he presents it. I've altered slightly during my arguments in ways that better serve my purpose.

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Believe those who are seeking the truth; doubt those who find it.
The truth will set you free. But first, it will piss you off
Cogito Ergo Sum
Stercus accidit

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Quote: from Descartes at 10:38 pm on July 5, 2009

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Hmm, I'll have to give it a look. Maybe it will be the thing to push me over the line haha.

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There's a part in The God Delusion where he pretty much says that agnostics are people who are too afraid to take a firm stance either way.

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I dont use everything he presents exactly as he presents it. I've altered slightly during my arguments in ways that better serve my purpose.

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Which just goes to show how ignorant the man is. Agnosticism is only that you deny that knowledge of god(s) is possible. It is separate from belief or lack thereof in a particular god(s).

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Did you actually read it? My paraphrase does him no justice whatsoever. Don't go off on the guy based on what I said before you actually read it.

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And when you're up watching cartoons at like 3 in the
morning you're nice and low to the ground
with your bean bag chair so when you
roll over you can sleep on the floor naked with your bag of cheetos

Also, I don't think that in order to be an atheist you have to have any profound thoughts or analyze things. Some people simply don't care much about the god debate, and seem to care more about other things.

oh and the five ways only does for kinkiness and nothing else

Post edited at 10:12 pm on July 5, 2009 by S0LITUDE

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All I know is that I know everything
-S0LITUDE

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Quote: from Effigy at 11:24 pm on July 5, 2009

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Quote: from Event Horizon at 8:19 pm on July 5, 2009

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Quote: from Cunning Stunt at 10:39 pm on July 5, 2009

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Quote: from Descartes at 10:38 pm on July 5, 2009

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Hmm, I'll have to give it a look. Maybe it will be the thing to push me over the line haha.

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  There's a part in The God Delusion where he pretty much says that agnostics are people who are too afraid to take a firm stance either way.

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 He also chastises people who make decisions without absolute evidence, and yet does just that. As humans we, in fact, have NO IDEA WHAT IS GOING ON in the universe. While it may be the case that the idea of God is not the most logical, showing the inconsistencies in religious ideologies hardly proves that no god exists, and, even if that is the case, standing on a soap box and preaching that no god exists is just as immature as preaching that god does.

 I can't see how one could find a more logical stance than "we don't know what the fuck is up"

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Where does he do that? Chapter and Verse please. Also we actually have a pretty good picture of what is going on in the universe, not perfect by any means but we aren't totally clueless.

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We are fucking clueless.

edit: The ancients were just as convinced that they were right; silly them, eh?

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"The ancients were just as convinced that they were right; silly them, eh?"

"Silly them" isn't quite the way I would describe it, but lets go with it; the ancients were also convinced, for example, that Sun the orbited the Earth. Silly them. And that bloodletting was an effective way to treat just about any ailment. Silly them. And that... you get the picture.

Also, way to ignore the main point of my post; I'll reiterate it here, in nice bold font, in case you forgot: Where does Dawkins chastise people who make decisions without absolute evidence and then turn around and do just that? Chapter and verse please.

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Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Truthiness.
Today's forecast: 70% Chance of Science.

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I really dislike the fact that atheism is becoming a youthful trend.

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Quote: from Event Horizon at 3:01 am on July 6, 2009

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 I really dislike the fact that atheism is becoming a youthful trend.

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That happened in the 1780s... where you been these past few centuries?

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I'd wager it's a bit more trendy now, largely thanks to the Internet.

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Let yourself be enchanted,
You just might break through
To ever ever after

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I think it's fine until these kids start turning into atheist bigots who want everyone to be like them. Extreme atheism tends to get close-minded at times, and then there's a lack of tolerance towards otehr peoples believes. But I also think it's just a phase.

Also, I don't think that in order to be an atheist you have to have any profound thoughts or analyze things. Some people simply don't care much about the god debate, and seem to care more about other things.

oh and the five ways only does for kinkiness and nothing else

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Name a single atheist extremist and what properties they have. Claiming that there are atheist extremists is like claiming that there are not-collecting-stamps extremists. Yes, there are marxist extremists and Buddhists extremists and there are atheists who are also at the same time extremists, but there is nothing called atheistic extremism.

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"The larger the island of knowledge, the longer the
shoreline of wonder" (Ralph W. Sockman)

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Name a single atheist extremist and what properties they have. Claiming that there are atheist extremists is like claiming that there are not-collecting-stamps extremists. Yes, there are marxist extremists and Buddhists extremists and there are atheists who are also at the same time extremists, but there is nothing called atheistic extremism.

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Point that it's very easy to be a non-stamp collecting extremist: you don't just not collect stamps, but it's your goal to eradicate stamp collecting completely. You devote all of your time and energy to decrying stamp collecting, harrass and attack those who do collect stamps, and do everything in your power to eradicate stamp collecting from the face of the planet.

That, dear child, is a non-stamp collecting extremist.

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Let yourself be enchanted,
You just might break through
To ever ever after

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Quote: from Moridin at 1:16 pm on July 6, 2009

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Name a single atheist extremist and what properties they have. Claiming that there are atheist extremists is like claiming that there are not-collecting-stamps extremists. Yes, there are marxist extremists and Buddhists extremists and there are atheists who are also at the same time extremists, but there is nothing called atheistic extremism.

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Point that it's very easy to be a non-stamp collecting extremist: you don't just not collect stamps, but it's your goal to eradicate stamp collecting completely. You devote all of your time and energy to decrying stamp collecting, harrass and attack those who do collect stamps, and do everything in your power to eradicate stamp collecting from the face of the planet.

That, dear child, is a non-stamp collecting extremist.

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No, that is a political extremist who does not think that individual choice in matters of preference should be allowed, who also, accidentally, does not collect stamps.

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"The larger the island of knowledge, the longer the
shoreline of wonder" (Ralph W. Sockman)

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Quote: from osmoticdespair at 4:05 am on July 6, 2009

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Quote: from Event Horizon at 3:01 am on July 6, 2009

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  I really dislike the fact that atheism is becoming a youthful trend.

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That happened in the 1780s... where you been these past few centuries?

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I'd wager it's a bit more trendy now, largely thanks to the Internet.

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Atheists are the most hated minority in the United States. Yeah, it is just a trend. People want to be despised and hated.

Has it ever occurred to you, or have you ever considered that there might be reasons to be skeptical of the overarching religious paradigm of our western culture?

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"The larger the island of knowledge, the longer the
shoreline of wonder" (Ralph W. Sockman)

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Quote: from exceedinglyrare at 8:32 pm on July 6, 2009

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Quote: from Moridin at 1:16 pm on July 6, 2009

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Name a single atheist extremist and what properties they have. Claiming that there are atheist extremists is like claiming that there are not-collecting-stamps extremists. Yes, there are marxist extremists and Buddhists extremists and there are atheists who are also at the same time extremists, but there is nothing called atheistic extremism.

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 Point that it's very easy to be a non-stamp collecting extremist: you don't just not collect stamps, but it's your goal to eradicate stamp collecting completely. You devote all of your time and energy to decrying stamp collecting, harrass and attack those who do collect stamps, and do everything in your power to eradicate stamp collecting from the face of the planet.  

 That, dear child, is a non-stamp collecting extremist.

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No, that is a political extremist who does not think that individual choice in matters of preference should be allowed, who also, accidentally, does not collect stamps.

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That's a stretch buddy.

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Has it ever occurred to you, or have you ever considered that there might be reasons to be skeptical of the overarching religious paradigm of our western culture?

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