Pages: 1 2  Next -- Posted by iconoclast at 1:35 am on Jan. 2, 2009 Part of the reason I have so much trouble being supportive is because of the way I was treated last time I was. I mean granted, I did it because I cared, not for any other reason but it seemed like every suggestion I made, people would step in to accuse me of being power hungry and a nuisance. I mean seriously, I know I was overzealous with moving topics and stuff, but it just seems like that stuff is trivial compared to support. It still seems like support has fallen by the wayside of drama, and I dislike this. Being appreciated for your support by the people you support is wonderful, but when you're treated like an annoying spammer by much of the mod team, it's irritating, if not infuriating. I don't know how much these attitudes are still around, but if they are, they need to stop, and people who are supportive need to be given the benefit of the doubt more. I mean seriously, you complain that I troll, but your past treatment of myself and other supportive members was hardly kind, to say the least. And it wasn't as if I was just marginally supportive. I was extremely supportive, as anyone around during that time would remember, though some try to deny this. You owe it to people who are supportive to give them basic respect. You also owe it to them to consider their suggestions without nitpicking. You also owe it to be reasonable with them. For example, putting me up for DOS was completely unnecessary, if I had simply been given a message to shut up, I would have. And many of you know that I would have, yet the whole thing was allowed to happen anyway. Of all people, supportive members should be welcomed, not ignored and out casted. Not only does the ehelp system need severe revamping, but the recognition of strong support leaders needs to go way up. Yeah, I didn't care before, but I'm starting to care more because I'm at least TRYING to be more supportive. I'm not nearly as serious before, but I'm just giving an account of why less people might want to be supportive. I was frustrated and left last time because of the decline in supportiveness and because of the poor treatment I was consistently given, so it would give me some peace of mind to know that others, and myself, aren't going to be harassed like this. -- Posted by MystiqueBeauty16 at 1:36 am on Jan. 2, 2009 You are generally very supportive. I don't see the problem. -- Posted by DopeSickGirl at 1:36 am on Jan. 2, 2009 indeed. -- Posted by Deeznutz FYC at 1:36 am on Jan. 2, 2009 Agreed. Mod pick please. -- Posted by xoAllixs0n at 1:36 am on Jan. 2, 2009 You admit you're a troll/spammer, so let's not get all "I hate it when people call me that," on us. And you're not supportive to me, thus I don't respect you. -- Posted by lucid dreams19 at 1:36 am on Jan. 2, 2009 i cannto see you being supportive, no offence -- Posted by iconoclast at 1:37 am on Jan. 2, 2009 Quote: from shesallithinkabout at 4:36 am on Jan. 2, 2009 i cannto see you being supportive, no offence Yeah, well things were different back in early 2007. Way different. -- Posted by S0LITUDE at 1:37 am on Jan. 2, 2009 I agree. People who support deserve more respect than anyone else and they sure have mine. -- Posted by VALIENT at 1:37 am on Jan. 2, 2009 This is poetic. -- Posted by roflfuckyou at 1:41 am on Jan. 2, 2009 I've read a few of your eHelp replies, and I do think you are actually a really good support leader. You know I disagree with you when you say that a lot of eHelps are written by trolls and spammers etc, but I understand where you're coming from. I don't know what happened with the mods and putting you up for DOS, or how you were treated last time, but I appreciate you as a support leader. -- Posted by See Me Now at 1:42 am on Jan. 2, 2009 I agree... this site is meant for people to BE supportive, and if the only people who are actually trying to do that are getting pissed off by the way they are treated, then the purpose of the site will no longer exist. I hope things have changed for you. If not, I hope they change soon. -- Posted by iconoclast at 1:42 am on Jan. 2, 2009 I'm in a terrible mood but I'm trying not to bite everyone in the ass, but David, you seriously need to revamp the ehelp system. Myself and others have been suggesting this for years and nothing has ever happened. I don't want to hold it against you though, but seriously, PLEASE work on the ehelp system soon. It's a joke now, and it's really frustrating to see people who need serious help being turned off. -- Posted by lucid dreams19 at 1:42 am on Jan. 2, 2009 Quote: from prisoner of hss at 3:37 am on Jan. 2, 2009 Quote: from shesallithinkabout at 4:36 am on Jan. 2, 2009 i cannto see you being supportive, no offence Yeah, well things were different back in early 2007. Way different. what happened to you!? -- Posted by iconoclast at 1:43 am on Jan. 2, 2009 Quote: from roflfuckyou at 4:41 am on Jan. 2, 2009 I've read a few of your eHelp replies, and I do think you are actually a really good support leader. You know I disagree with you when you say that a lot of eHelps are written by trolls and spammers etc, but I understand where you're coming from. I don't know what happened with the mods and putting you up for DOS, or how you were treated last time, but I appreciate you as a support leader. I never said they were written by trolls, just new members who don't know what they're doing. As much as we don't want to touch ehelp, we really have to have strict standards for what goes in there, because if we don't, it just deteriorates. The condition of the ehelp system is a lot worse than 2007, let alone 2005-2006. -- Posted by iconoclast at 1:51 am on Jan. 2, 2009 Quote: from xoallixs0n at 4:36 am on Jan. 2, 2009 You admit you're a troll/spammer, so let's not get all "I hate it when people call me that," on us. And you're not supportive to me, thus I don't respect you. I really don't care if people call me a troll/spammer. I do it because I'm bored, and honestly I think there's nothing wrong with having a sense of humor and trolling a bit. I just get annoyed when people complain so much about me being a 'troll' and ignore my past history of supportiveness. If you are referring to the 'annoying spammer' part, that was on my old account back in 06/07. Given that I rarely trolled back then and supported a ton, being degraded like that really wasn't cool. -- Posted by roflfuckyou at 1:55 am on Jan. 2, 2009 Quote: from prisoner of hss at 8:43 pm on Jan. 2, 2009 Quote: from roflfuckyou at 4:41 am on Jan. 2, 2009 I've read a few of your eHelp replies, and I do think you are actually a really good support leader.    You know I disagree with you when you say that a lot of eHelps are written by trolls and spammers etc, but I understand where you're coming from.    I don't know what happened with the mods and putting you up for DOS, or how you were treated last time, but I appreciate you as a support leader. I never said they were written by trolls, just new members who don't know what they're doing. As much as we don't want to touch ehelp, we really have to have strict standards for what goes in there, because if we don't, it just deteriorates. The condition of the ehelp system is a lot worse than 2007, let alone 2005-2006. Hmm, I see your point and in some ways I agree with you. But we can't judge what is an emergency to someone, you know. -- Posted by iconoclast at 1:57 am on Jan. 2, 2009 Quote: from roflfuckyou at 4:55 am on Jan. 2, 2009 Quote: from prisoner of hss at 8:43 pm on Jan. 2, 2009 Quote: from roflfuckyou at 4:41 am on Jan. 2, 2009 I've read a few of your eHelp replies, and I do think you are actually a really good support leader.   You know I disagree with you when you say that a lot of eHelps are written by trolls and spammers etc, but I understand where you're coming from.   I don't know what happened with the mods and putting you up for DOS, or how you were treated last time, but I appreciate you as a support leader. I never said they were written by trolls, just new members who don't know what they're doing. As much as we don't want to touch ehelp, we really have to have strict standards for what goes in there, because if we don't, it just deteriorates. The condition of the ehelp system is a lot worse than 2007, let alone 2005-2006. Hmm, I see your point and in some ways I agree with you. But we can't judge what is an emergency to someone, you know. I think we can tell reasonably well for the most part, some are iffy, and I have no problem letting them stay if we're not entirely sure. But the majority are easy to tell (one day active and no topics) and would probably actually get better feedback in the forums. I mean, it's not like we're going to move it to DTRM or something, if the feature existed. -- Posted by iconoclast at 2:02 am on Jan. 2, 2009 I would also like mod answers to just *why* I was treated like I was so power hungry. I mean, yeah I was a bit zealous in changing things and arguing with people, but none of that was because I was power hungry. I just genuinely wanted to help. So, it doesn't make any sense, at all : / -- Posted by roflfuckyou at 2:07 am on Jan. 2, 2009 Quote: from prisoner of hss at 8:57 pm on Jan. 2, 2009 think we can tell reasonably well for the most part, some are iffy, and I have no problem letting them stay if we're not entirely sure. But the majority are easy to tell (one day active and no topics) and would probably actually get better feedback in the forums. I mean, it's not like we're going to move it to DTRM or something, if the feature existed. But even if we moved it to TDEI, chances are it would still get the same responses from people looking for a quick point saying something like "that sucks man" or "just talk to her" or "see a doctor duh". The one day active with no topics, well we shouldn't judge based on that. Maybe they joined specifically to make that eHelp (not knowing you don't have to be a member). I don't think the eHelp forum is that bad, I know a lot of them pail in comparison to some that are asking real emergency type questions, but to those people it's a serious thing. If there are some that the mods think shouldn't be there, they can message the member and delete the post, but if it's guest or anonymous that makes it difficult. If that feature (being able to move from eHelp to forum) were available we wouldn't be able to move the guest posts though. -- Posted by iconoclast at 2:11 am on Jan. 2, 2009 We wouldn't usually move something to tdei, because topics about depression should stay. I'm not talking about those, I'm talking mostly about stuff like pregnancy, dating, cheating, etc. There seems to be a massive amount of those by members who just don't know what they're doing. There's always the chance that someone joined just to make the ehelp, and I've seen people like that, but the vast majority of the time, that's not the case. And I know some people consider 'petty' issues to be an emergency; those should stay, but I'm not talking about those. I'm talking about the ones that are almost certainly put there accidentally. And nothing is perfect, but again, we have to make sacrifices to keep ehelp about real support. Ideally we could have everything perfect, but we can't. Nonetheless, the benefits we get from 'cleaning up' ehelp will far outweigh the occasional guest who really meant to put it there and has it moved (as callous as this sounds). It's just necessary. IDK, maybe a feature could be designed to move guest ehelps to the forums, or at least the serious forum. -- Posted by roflfuckyou at 2:21 am on Jan. 2, 2009 Quote: from prisoner of hss at 9:11 pm on Jan. 2, 2009 We wouldn't usually move something to tdei, because topics about depression should stay. I'm not talking about those, I'm talking mostly about stuff like pregnancy, dating, cheating, etc. There seems to be a massive amount of those by members who just don't know what they're doing.   There's always the chance that someone joined just to make the ehelp, and I've seen people like that, but the vast majority of the time, that's not the case.   And I know some people consider 'petty' issues to be an emergency; those should stay, but I'm not talking about those. I'm talking about the ones that are almost certainly put there accidentally. And nothing is perfect, but again, we have to make sacrifices to keep ehelp about real support. Ideally we could have everything perfect, but we can't. Nonetheless, the benefits we get from 'cleaning up' ehelp will far outweigh the occasional guest who really meant to put it there and has it moved (as callous as this sounds). It's just necessary. IDK, maybe a feature could be designed to move guest ehelps to the forums, or at least the serious forum. In many ways I agree with you. You should put the idea to David, to give some outlines to mods about what should be kept in the eHelp forum and what shouldn't and maybe those that shouldn't be there, be moved to the Serious Forum. And some how find a way for guest posts to be moved there. -- Posted by hithere at 9:55 am on Jan. 2, 2009 Nobody accused you of anything because you were being supportive. Whether or not you were supportive, you would've been treated like that because of the attitude you displayed about power or whatever you wanna call it. You don't owe it to supportive people to hold back your opinions more often that you do for non-supportive people. Supportive members should be welcomed when they're not really annoying otherwise. It is possible, actually. You will be recognized for being supportive regardless of whether you're power hungry, and you will be recognized for being power hungry regardless of whether you're supportive. -- Posted by iconoclast at 9:58 am on Jan. 2, 2009 Quote: from hithere at 12:55 pm on Jan. 2, 2009 Nobody accused you of anything because you were being supportive. Whether or not you were supportive, you would've been treated like that because of the attitude you displayed about power or whatever you wanna call it. You don't owe it to supportive people to hold back your opinions more often that you do for non-supportive people. Supportive members should be welcomed when they're not really annoying otherwise. It is possible, actually. You will be recognized for being supportive regardless of whether you're power hungry, and you will be recognized for being power hungry regardless of whether you're supportive. It sure seemed like it was because I was being supportive. It seemed like this was seen as a threat. I don't mean specifically ehelp, but trying to help in general. The only attitudes I expressed about power were annoyance that people were promoted who weren't supportive. I personally don't see anything power hungry about that. -- Posted by Bud2400 at 10:13 am on Jan. 2, 2009 Back in early 2007 on your DoomMaker account? I always got the impression that being supportive had fuck all to do with people calling you power hungry and whatever.  You were making a ton of those topics about everything that needs to be fixed, albeit more aggressively than you do right now.  As a result, I noticed it rub off the wrong way on people and what do they do?  They look for the first thing to accuse you of that comes to mind! Your suggestions these days are presented in a much more mild way and don't come off as so spiteful, hence why I don't think you have so many people being antagonistic towards you today as you did then.  Any time somebody gets their panties in a frill, they're going to try to talk shit to you regardless of anything else.  I don't think it'd be any different if you weren't a support leader, although I can see why they would use that to their advantage when you were. -- Posted by hithere at 10:16 am on Jan. 2, 2009 When that annoyance takes the form of lots of topics about mods, it can be seen by others as power hungry, even if you didn't personally see it that way. Anyways, just tell your haters to shut up and start supporting the next time they start accusing you. -- Posted by carbonara at 12:46 pm on Jan. 2, 2009 In my opinion you were one of the best SL's this site has ever seen. You have the potential to do great things for this site, you have the potential to be a very excellent moderator in fact. But you have in recent times ruined your reputation. In the last few months you have been increasingly trollish and it may take a while for you to get that 'supportive role' back, but you are more than capable of doing that. You're a very intelligent guy and I personally don't view you as 'power hungry'. A few names come to mind with that title, but you're not one of them. I hate that term 'over moderating', what a load of BS, if you see something that needs to be done then do it if you can. Who cares if you've got a ton of actions in a short space of time. I don't know why some of the existing mods see that as a bad thing. -- Posted by The Professional at 12:57 pm on Jan. 2, 2009 Quote: from carbonara at 2:46 pm on Jan. 2, 2009 I hate that term 'over moderating', what a load of BS, if you see something that needs to be done then do it if you can. Who cares if you've got a ton of actions in a short space of time. I don't know why some of the existing mods see that as a bad thing. I think you're interpreting "over moderating" wrongly.  Over-moderation isn't acting on things that need to be acted on, it's going too far and acting on the tiniest things or things that have no business being moderated in the first place, searching for things to act on and applying illogical sense to justify the moderating, going TOO far with moderation, basically.  There's definitely a line, and over-moderation is definitely not a load of "BS." It's probably the number one issue with moderators, both here and in general. -- Posted by medjai at 1:14 pm on Jan. 2, 2009 I completely agree with this part: For example, putting me up for DOS was completely unnecessary, if I had simply been given a message to shut up, I would have. And many of you know that I would have, yet the whole thing was allowed to happen anyway.   -- Posted by amiee at 1:47 pm on Jan. 2, 2009 i don't see why you can't carry on making all your suggestions but being supportive too? yeah, i know, all the shit you got put you off and you think supportive members need more respect and all that stuff, but why should negative attitudes from the mods (or other members) stop you doing what you're fighting for with all these suggestions? I'm not nearly as serious before... this is good. i like you when you're supportive. who cares how everyone else treats you, what you're doing is between you and the person you're supporting. that's it. if you carry on as you are now then not only are you supporting people but you'll also have the support of other members, i would think, when proposing all these new ideas. and if not, well, whatever. maybe you and i differ here (in fact, it would appear that we do) but i think it'd help to just... not give a shit what people thought of you making these suggestions and trying to better the site. find the people on your side and continue with your suggestions but, more importantly, continue with your support. it's good, not that i need to tell you that. -- Posted by carbonara at 3:02 pm on Jan. 2, 2009 Quote: from The Professional at 8:57 pm on Jan. 2, 2009 Quote: from carbonara at 2:46 pm on Jan. 2, 2009 I hate that term 'over moderating', what a load of BS, if you see something that needs to be done then do it if you can. Who cares if you've got a ton of actions in a short space of time. I don't know why some of the existing mods see that as a bad thing. I think you're interpreting "over moderating" wrongly.  Over-moderation isn't acting on things that need to be acted on, it's going too far and acting on the tiniest things or things that have no business being moderated in the first place, searching for things to act on and applying illogical sense to justify the moderating, going TOO far with moderation, basically.  There's definitely a line, and over-moderation is definitely not a load of "BS." It's probably the number one issue with moderators, both here and in general. But I don't see how that can be done with the powers SL's are given. Obviously that can be done by a moderator, but SLs have very little powers that can be over moderated. Pages: 1 2  Next