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-- Posted by Tavis at 8:19 am on April 20, 2008
I have thought about this long and hard, and even had a class of mine discuss this, and I have made a theory how children are raised, and what is to become of their lives, due to their influences. Lets start with the simplest influence, their parents. Think back long and hard about how your parents raised you. Did they make you do things, or was it an option..? Most parents, I feel, are pushing things upon their children at a younger age, which is transforming them into something they might not want to be. Take the colour of their room for example. You have a son. Most people automatically want that room to be painted blue, to reflect him being a male. This also works with girls and the colour pink, of course. You are assuming that they want this, instead of letting them pick. I think that people should just paint their rooms white, let it be neutral, so the kids can decide once they have that sense of responsibility. The next thing, is what hobbies they are enrolled into. Sure, influencing them to stay active by joining a sport is fine, or playing an instrument, but really, don't choose for them. Although I might be stereotyping a little, most people want their children to play football. However, not all children like it, and only choose that sport to fit in. I suggest leaving all the doors open at all times, to choose what they feel is right. So what if you son or daughter wants to dance, let them. Don't shut doors, or else that might be another career option closed for you son at a younger age. Now, the main one I want to focus on is the toys they have. Think about how you have turned out. Most of you didn't have a 'ps2' or '360'. Some of you had a sega or another of those older systems, but except for that, there was no talking toys that make their own story. You were allowed to express yourself in any way possible, using your simple, 4-wheeled toy truck, and little work bench where you would make mud pie galore. The barbies with a home, and that was it. You were given choices on what to do, allowed to let your imagination run wild. Now, you have the barbies that talk, and tell you what to do, you have cars, that actually talk, so there is no need for this imagination. Almost all of the toys that are being produced give you a very limited imagination space, because they have someone do it for you. I just don't see that it is right, limiting your children's imagination like that. So, go out with a very open mind, bring your child with you, and let him choose what looks fun, but make sure that it isn't going to restrict his/her limits. Also, don't choose who you want your child to be. If he wants to play with barbies, so be it. If she wants to play with trucks, so be it. Let them choose what they want to play with, who they want to play with, what they want to play! I'm not sure, but maybe people will be a lot more accepting in the newest generation, if they are allowed to do what they want. Finally, I'd also like to point out how violent kids are in the newest generation, the ones going into grade 1 now. I have a little friend who is in grade two, but he is very violent. He tries to beat me up, and always is angry. As are two little girls I know. One rips my hair while the other chokes me. Think of what is happening to our next generation. They are being influnced way to much with violence. The WWE for example. Parents seem more and more lenient to them watching these kinds of things. My parents didn't even allow me to watch Power Rangers, because it was violent, and they don't want violence at a younger age. Also, the video games they play. My older brother, SilverDoor, works at an 'Electronic Boutique Games (EB Games)', and parents don't even care the littlest that they are buying their 7 year old a game where there is swearing, violence, guns, drugs. The key game is Grand theft auto, but there is so many out there, that keep influencing the way children act.
-- Posted by halfinsane at 2:43 pm on April 20, 2008
I agree with almost everything you said. I'm not sure that I agree that video games inhibit the imagination. I say this because I know that video games in my childhood sparked my imagination. I'd play a game, and then think about the world of the game, and basically fill in the parts not provided in the game. Video games gave me ideas for stories and other video games and I'd write those down and make drawings. I agree that parents shouldn't let their children spend an excessive amount of time on a video game, but I think that video games can be some of the most imagination sparking toys around today.
Now as far as regulating what children play and watch, I completely agree. Parents need to judge for themselves what shows children watch and what games they play. Game ratings are pretty strict (and sometimes I'd say too strict) guidelines, but parents should still play a game or watch a show before letting their children play or watch it. That said, it should be the responsibility of the parent, and not of the manufacturers,vendors, or government.
I also heartily agree with not forcing children into any hobby or sport. My older cousin's husband forces his children to do Karate because he owns a martial arts school, two out of three absolutely hate it. Even though one of these said children is now 17 she's still forced to do it, but that's an off topic issue since we're talking about children here.
Now, as far as you being forbidden from watching power rangers when you were a kid...that's just depressing.
-- Posted by Tavis at 4:13 pm on April 20, 2008
I didn't really mean that games are bad, but that certain games are. As a child, we were given one system, which was the sega. We didn't need to have every system, because that one had also sparked my imagination also. But yes, too much time on a video game makes you sucked in, not increases the way you think. And the power rangers, it was most likely because there was 3 of us, all guys, so we didn't want to be fighting eachother, imitating what they do.. I think.
-- Posted by Disposition at 6:37 pm on April 20, 2008
I definitely agree with the part about kids being violent. I babysit a little girl who turned 7 last December, and she is always trying to beat me up or take off my clothes. She blatantly disregards rules, and to be quite honest, she acts like an angsty, immature teenager. I hate to blame the media, but it does cause a lot of society's problems.
-- Posted by exceedinglyrare at 8:13 pm on April 20, 2008
If I have an infant, how is said infant, regardless of gender, supposed to choose his or her own room color?
-- Posted by Missyjane at 1:18 am on April 21, 2008
Choose a room colour yourself! It's your house!
I don't believe a family should be a democracy.
My family has always been a benevolent autocracy.
Sure it's more than slightly fucked up, but at least myself and my many siblings have boundarys.
I didn't get fancy toys, or video games. I played with the other kids in the street, kicking a footy or playing in someone elses cubby house. Kids time nowadays is so structured. I did Scouts, still do and thats all. Kids these days are put into so many different classes and teams and organised activities they don't need their imagination, because they dont "play".
-- Posted by Corrupted Innocence at 10:38 am on April 21, 2008
After reading this it has made me think. You talk about a child should have free choice which i think is totally right as a child deserves to have that choice in what they want to play with. For example i do placement at nursery's as part of my college course and you would see little boys in a dress, that shows they do have an understanding that children deserve free choice. Whereas in a household it might be completely different and a child is told "oh that's for girls/boys" and i feel that is unfair to the child as they should have the choice in what they want to play with. About the room colour I'm on borderline her, maybe painting it a colour which isn't stereotypical might be best as to be honest white walls are boring, then when that child is able to make their own choices then they should be able to have the choice in the colour of their walls. I get it's all about personal choice and about the video games parents will do anything really to keep their kids entertained so they will let them play the games, however sometimes this is wrong. However it's the parents own choice on how they want to bring up their child so who are we to say any different. We might not think it's right however their choice.
-- Posted by Tavis at 2:56 pm on April 21, 2008
Quote: from exceedinglyrare at 11:13 pm on April 20, 2008
 If I have an infant, how is said infant, regardless of gender, supposed to choose his or her own room color?
Leave it white until teen years, and then let him or her choose. Neutrality until they are responsible to chose their own things.
-- Posted by dunebug at 3:07 pm on April 21, 2008
I don't think I agree with a single thing you said, except possibly about the lack of imagination. I'm a product of the 80s. I was allowed to watch R movies from the time I was 7. I played semi violent video games, although they didn't really interest me. We used our imaginations more but aside from that, I don't see a whole lot of generational distance between myself in the 80s/early 90s and my son in the 00's now. I think there's something to be said for letting a child make small decision but I hardly think the answer is basically saying "Do what you want so long as you have piano practice." That actually tends to raise lazy children who do what they want -- sit and eat nothing but junk food, sleep 15 hours a day and play video games. Because most kids and teens will not eat properly or go to school or keep a healthy routine if left to themselves. I think the larger problem with this generation is far more obvious. The lack of an accessible parent in the household. In my generation, I had many many friends who had at least one stay at home parent. This meant that they rarely had unsupervised time, they bonded better with their parent and always had someone around to ask questions and learn from. Nowadays the inflated cost of living has forced most families to have two working parents and even then, it's often tight with bills. This means that even young children, Grade 5 and up, are often "latch key" and left to supervise themselves from when school ends at 2 or 3 until their parent gets home at 6 or later. The parent is so tired after work, they basically come home, make dinner, bark a few orders about chores and then go to bed. There's little bonding, little being around. I think this is causing huge problems and a lot of positives would come from putting a parent back in the households.
-- Posted by exceedinglyrare at 3:55 pm on April 21, 2008
Quote: from Tavis at 5:56 pm on April 21, 2008
Quote: from exceedinglyrare at 11:13 pm on April 20, 2008
If I have an infant, how is said infant, regardless of gender, supposed to choose his or her own room color?
Leave it white until teen years, and then let him or her choose. Neutrality until they are responsible to chose their own things.
How boring. Sorry, but I think that while your idea has merit to an extent, you take it too far. I'm going to be painting my children's nursery walls (or, rather, my FMIL will be doing so, as she loves painting murals), and if you think they are brainwashed because I chose a soothing blue instead of a stark and blinding white, you're silly in the head.
-- Posted by Tavis at 3:58 pm on April 21, 2008
Quote: from exceedinglyrare at 6:55 pm on April 21, 2008
Quote: from Tavis at 5:56 pm on April 21, 2008
Quote: from exceedinglyrare at 11:13 pm on April 20, 2008
If I have an infant, how is said infant, regardless of gender, supposed to choose his or her own room color?
Leave it white until teen years, and then let him or her choose. Neutrality until they are responsible to chose their own things.
How boring. Sorry, but I think that while your idea has merit to an extent, you take it too far. I'm going to be painting my children's nursery walls (or, rather, my FMIL will be doing so, as she loves painting murals), and if you think they are brainwashed because I chose a soothing blue instead of a stark and blinding white, you're silly in the head.
No, I don't think it's a major difference, it was more of a metaphorical statement. Painting your walls blue can and does mean it literally, but can also mean the general tone towards your kids and what they do.
-- Posted by exceedinglyrare at 8:13 pm on April 21, 2008
If you didn't mean painting walls literally, why did you use it as an example?
-- Posted by Tavis at 4:12 am on April 22, 2008
Quote: from exceedinglyrare at 11:13 pm on April 21, 2008
If you didn't mean painting walls literally, why did you use it as an example?
It can be both literally and metaphorically.
-- Posted by exceedinglyrare at 5:09 am on April 22, 2008
It certainly isn't literally; the wallpaper in my room growing up was orange, and I know many children who have grown up in rooms of the same color and yet turned out entirely differently. The idea that the color a parent chooses for a child's walls affects his or her development is absurd, at the very least.
-- Posted by norock at 7:26 am on April 22, 2008
Quote: from Tavis at 11:19 am on April 20, 2008
I have thought about this long and hard, and even had a class of mine discuss this, and I have made a theory how children are raised, and what is to become of their lives, due to their influences.
this should be interesting
Lets start with the simplest influence, their parents. Think back long and hard about how your parents raised you. Did they make you do things, or was it an option..? Most parents, I feel, are pushing things upon their children at a younger age, which is transforming them into something they might not want to be.
The funny thing is, is that one CANNOT think back long and hard to the times that they were a child, sure some fleeting memories are still there, but thoughts and desires from that time were not stored, they COULD not be at that stage in development. lets read further and see what else becomes of this.
Take the colour of their room for example. You have a son. Most people automatically want that room to be painted blue, to reflect him being a male. This also works with girls and the colour pink, of course. You are assuming that they want this, instead of letting them pick. I think that people should just paint their rooms white, let it be neutral, so the kids can decide once they have that sense of responsibility.
You want a 12 month old baby to decide the color of his or her room?
or do you intend to wait until said child is 2-4 when the first words start coming out and then paint it whatever comes out first:
"boat"
"you see that honey, he said boat"
"yep, lets get some boat wall paper!" thats just silly. or do you want to wait until the child is 6 and can actually make decisions [albeit they are not informed, they are impuslive] and paint it the neon pink and black and red that the child wants? children, during their developmental years need to be shaped [and are consequently shaped by EVERYTHING we do, so that our actions reflect who they become, even the smallest of habits]
The next thing, is what hobbies they are enrolled into. Sure, influencing them to stay active by joining a sport is fine, or playing an instrument, but really, don't choose for them. Although I might be stereotyping a little, most people want their children to play football. However, not all children like it, and only choose that sport to fit in. I suggest leaving all the doors open at all times, to choose what they feel is right. So what if you son or daughter wants to dance, let them. Don't shut doors, or else that might be another career option closed for you son at a younger age.
You are a moron.
5-6 year olds have no clue about the options available to them, and lecturing them as to the basis and how-to of every sport so that they can make a logical, educated decision is a silly notion. parents enroll their kids in sports and hobbies that THEY liked as a kid in hopes that the kid will enjoy them too. It also serves as a way for kids to make new friends as well as learn sociability skills and physical fitness. what BETTER decision would the kid make, whose attention span is no longer than a minute? Of course, if the kid doesn't like it, I don't think one should MAKE them continue, but the parent should enroll them in ANOTHER sport, let the kid try that out and see what happens. Are you under the impression that pre-teens are rational, logical beings? they are developing and have a limited grasp of the world, and need to be shaped. They are impulsive, and need to be pushed into things so that they can experience them for themselves and make opinions on said matters.
Now, the main one I want to focus on is the toys they have. Think about how you have turned out. Most of you didn't have a 'ps2' or '360'. Some of you had a sega or another of those older systems, but except for that, there was no talking toys that make their own story. You were allowed to express yourself in any way possible, using your simple, 4-wheeled toy truck, and little work bench where you would make mud pie galore. The barbies with a home, and that was it. You were given choices on what to do, allowed to let your imagination run wild. Now, you have the barbies that talk, and tell you what to do, you have cars, that actually talk, so there is no need for this imagination.
I do agree with this point, children should be pushed to use their imagination, and develop their own concept of the world around them, and the experiences people face in life. [even if that experience is that of an ambulance "whoosh"ing down the road.]
Also, don't choose who you want your child to be. If he wants to play with barbies, so be it. If she wants to play with trucks, so be it. Let them choose what they want to play with, who they want to play with, what they want to play! I'm not sure, but maybe people will be a lot more accepting in the newest generation, if they are allowed to do what they want.
I don't quite agree with this, Parents should raise their kids as they see fit. I do not see any harm in showing your son that trucks are more fun than barbies. I see where you are going: "if he's going to be gay he's going to be gay" but I don't think that there is a gay gene, I think that children are raised a certain way, and if their internal conception of normalcy and sexual tendency react a certain way with their nurture, then the result is a homosexual. I do not think that a 4 year old will play with barbies because he likes her shoes, or dress. Its imagination, thats all. So why not simply channel that imagination to something more along the lines of a childhood boy, if thats what the kid is. [again, sure if the kid cries about it and wants the barbie back, give it to him, but if he is just as content with the trucks, or the gi joes, whats the harm?]
Finally, I'd also like to point out how violent kids are in the newest generation, the ones going into grade 1 now. I have a little friend who is in grade two, but he is very violent. He tries to beat me up, and always is angry. As are two little girls I know. One rips my hair while the other chokes me. Think of what is happening to our next generation. They are being influnced way to much with violence.
I don't know if this is the nature of television and games today that do this [which most kids usually grow out of when they learn the TRUE concepts of right and wrong], or if it something else entirely, but i DO know that what is the MAJOR cause is the lack of parental strictness. All of these liberal hippy parents think that children should be free to express themselves without being "judged". WRONG! kids need discipline so that they can react smoothly with social norms. kids do not know that flailing their arms wildly in public is wrong if you let them do it because "they are expressing themselves", so they wont see anything wrong with doing it in class, or hitting another kid [who the first kid probably doesn't even care about, since he is not aware that the other kid is like him and sees other people]. Kids are not aware of separate minds and individuals, there is themselves, and the other things around them that move. Mommy is the pretty one, daddy is the strong one, billy is the smelly one, mary is the funny one. But I am the only one really here, they are all just "things" to kids, who don't understand sentience of other beings until early pre-teen years.
The WWE for example. Parents seem more and more lenient to them watching these kinds of things. My parents didn't even allow me to watch Power Rangers, because it was violent, and they don't want violence at a younger age. Also, the video games they play. My older brother, SilverDoor, works at an 'Electronic Boutique Games (EB Games)', and parents don't even care the littlest that they are buying their 7 year old a game where there is swearing, violence, guns, drugs. The key game is Grand theft auto, but there is so many out there, that keep influencing the way children act.
shouldn't you let your kids decide what they want to watch? you let them decide everything else...Or is it that they can make educated decisions about their sports and recreation, but not their leisure? though I do agree less video games and more out door encouragement. you have a misunderstanding as to how well kids understand the world, my friend... edit:
also, white walls reflect light, even at night the room would be bright without the windows blacked out. babies tend to wake more often during the night in white rooms due to the excitability of the reflection. darker colors are much better for babies sleep patterns [even yellows and pinks absorb light and allow the kids to sleep]
what the hell does it matter the color of the room anyway? are you under the impression that your room color made you who you are today? If so, then I maintain that you are a very dull person. If the kid wants to change it later on, sure let him/her change it, but don't leave the wall white because you don't want to infringe upon the 14 year decision making process of your child, come on now.
-- Posted by Tavis at 3:17 pm on April 22, 2008
Quote: from norock at 10:26 am on April 22, 2008
Quote: from Tavis at 11:19 am on April 20, 2008 The funny thing is, is that one CANNOT think back long and hard to the times that they were a child, sure some fleeting memories are still there, but thoughts and desires from that time were not stored, they COULD not be at that stage in development. lets read further and see what else becomes of this.
I'm sure most people can remember the way their parents treated them. I even used an example, how mine didn't let me watch power rangers.
You want a 12 month old baby to decide the color of his or her room?
or do you intend to wait until said child is 2-4 when the first words start coming out and then paint it whatever comes out first:
"boat"
"you see that honey, he said boat"
"yep, lets get some boat wall paper!" thats just silly. or do you want to wait until the child is 6 and can actually make decisions [albeit they are not informed, they are impuslive] and paint it the neon pink and black and red that the child wants? children, during their developmental years need to be shaped [and are consequently shaped by EVERYTHING we do, so that our actions reflect who they become, even the smallest of habits]
Babies are 12 months old. Children are 5-10. And of course you wouldn't make them chose, just if they like a colour, you shouldn't keep it the colour you want.
You are a moron.
5-6 year olds have no clue about the options available to them, and lecturing them as to the basis and how-to of every sport so that they can make a logical, educated decision is a silly notion.
Of course it would be. And they will know enough at that age to chose a sport that they want, or none at all, instead of you pushing them to play a certain sport.
what BETTER decision would the kid make, whose attention span is no longer than a minute?
I don't know about you, but I'm pretty sure that most kids have attention spans that last over a minute.
Of course, if the kid doesn't like it, I don't think one should MAKE them continue, but the parent should enroll them in ANOTHER sport, let the kid try that out and see what happens.
That's what I'm stressing. Leaving options open.
Are you under the impression that pre-teens are rational, logical beings? they are developing and have a limited grasp of the world, and need to be shaped. They are impulsive, and need to be pushed into things so that they can experience them for themselves and make opinions on said matters.
Yes, they do need to, but once again, leave options open, if they want to dance, so be it, if they want to play any sport, let them, don't push them into a sport they don't like.
I do agree with this point, children should be pushed to use their imagination, and develop their own concept of the world around them, and the experiences people face in life. [even if that experience is that of an ambulance "whoosh"ing down the road.]
I don't quite agree with this, Parents should raise their kids as they see fit. I do not see any harm in showing your son that trucks are more fun than barbies. I see where you are going: "if he's going to be gay he's going to be gay" but I don't think that there is a gay gene, I think that children are raised a certain way, and if their internal conception of normalcy and sexual tendency react a certain way with their nurture, then the result is a homosexual. I do not think that a 4 year old will play with barbies because he likes her shoes, or dress. Its imagination, thats all. So why not simply channel that imagination to something more along the lines of a childhood boy, if thats what the kid is.
I'm not saying that if he is going to be gay then let him, I'm saying, as said above, let all doors stay open so they aren't pressured into anything to fit in.
I don't know if this is the nature of television and games today that do this [which most kids usually grow out of when they learn the TRUE concepts of right and wrong], or if it something else entirely, but i DO know that what is the MAJOR cause is the lack of parental strictness.
Well, each to their own, I'm blaming the media and whatnot for how violent they are, but of course it's not 100% anybodies fault.
All of these liberal hippy parents think that children should be free to express themselves without being "judged". WRONG! kids need discipline so that they can react smoothly with social norms. kids do not know that flailing their arms wildly in public is wrong if you let them do it because "they are expressing themselves", so they wont see anything wrong with doing it in class, or hitting another kid [who the first kid probably doesn't even care about, since he is not aware that the other kid is like him and sees other people]. Kids are not aware of separate minds and individuals, there is themselves, and the other things around them that move. Mommy is the pretty one, daddy is the strong one, billy is the smelly one, mary is the funny one. But I am the only one really here, they are all just "things" to kids, who don't understand sentience of other beings until early pre-teen years.
This, I do agree with, because they aren't being strict at all. Sure I'm saying let a kid be who they want to be, but still, teach them morals.
shouldn't you let your kids decide what they want to watch? you let them decide everything else...Or is it that they can make educated decisions about their sports and recreation, but not their leisure? though I do agree less video games and more out door encouragement. you have a misunderstanding as to how well kids understand the world, my friend...
Sure they can chose what they want to watch, but not when it gets to the point where monkey-see-monkey-do because they saw someone's head get bashed in on a wrestling show that uses highly trained people to do so.
edit:
also, white walls reflect light, even at night the room would be bright without the windows blacked out. babies tend to wake more often during the night in white rooms due to the excitability of the reflection. darker colors are much better for babies sleep patterns [even yellows and pinks absorb light and allow the kids to sleep]
what the hell does it matter the color of the room anyway? are you under the impression that your room color made you who you are today? If so, then I maintain that you are a very dull person. If the kid wants to change it later on, sure let him/her change it, but don't leave the wall white because you don't want to infringe upon the 14 year decision making process of your child, come on now.
Fair enough. I just stress that they should have a neutral room colour, not one for either gender.
-- Posted by norock at 3:53 pm on April 22, 2008
Quote: from Tavis at 6:17 pm on April 22, 2008
Babies are 12 months old. Children are 5-10. And of course you wouldn't make them chose, just if they like a colour, you shouldn't keep it the colour you want.
A parent has the right to color the rooms in their house any color they see fit. What is the big deal about the kids room being painted?
Of course it would be. And they will know enough at that age to chose a sport that they want, or none at all, instead of you pushing them to play a certain sport.
No, they don't really. Kids can't drive over to the park to play ball, they can't go to the local Y and pick up basket ball. Parents need to push their kids into sports so that they at least start them. If the kid doesn't like it, of course, don't force them, but you can't expect them to consider what they can gain from sports at such a young age.
I don't know about you, but I'm pretty sure that most kids have attention spans that last over a minute.
I don't know about you, but I know the meaning of "hyperbole".
Yes, they do need to, but once again, leave options open, if they want to dance, so be it, if they want to play any sport, let them, don't push them into a sport they don't like.
How many kids do you see on the football field or the soccer field or baseball, whatever, saying "MOOOM I hate this sport, don't make me playyyy". Please.
I'm not saying that if he is going to be gay then let him, I'm saying, as said above, let all doors stay open so they aren't pressured into anything to fit in.
What pressure, they HAVE no other experience. They are being shaped, without shaping them, they will be -need I say it—shapeless, so to speak. Kids need to be influenced so that they can become developed persons.
Sure they can chose what they want to watch, but not when it gets to the point where monkey-see-monkey-do because they saw someone's head get bashed in on a wrestling show that uses highly trained people to do so
So then you agree that parents should intervene with their kids lives when they believe that it will benefit them, huh?
Leaving kids to try to develop their sense of self without understanding social norms will only lead to confusion and underdevelopment [socially]
Fair enough. I just stress that they should have a neutral room colour, not one for either gender.
Why?
What is the point of leaving it gender neutral? If the kid grows up and says "I want my room to be pink" its still up to the parents to oversee what is done to their house.
Do you honestly believe that the color of your room as a kid made you who you are today? Honestly?
-- Posted by dunebug at 4:08 pm on April 22, 2008
I have to say I agree with Norock. Your idea is sweet in theory Tavis, that children should be respected and allowed to make as many decisions as possible. But as someone with a small child, I can tell you that it's just not practical. As Norock mentioned, without any sort of guide children just float aimlessly in life. Few children, especially young children, are self-motivated. Even those that are, lack the life and practical knowledge of how to get involved in sports, activities and things like that. The job of the parent is to guide the child, it's not to force, but pushing your child into sports and not letting them quit every time they have a bad day is what separates a good parent from a lazy one. I have rarely to never seen a healthy, active, happy product from a household where the parent just shrugged every time the kid wanted to flunk out of something, because they wanted to be supportive in their child's "dislike", like you're encouraging. All they ended up with is a child with self-esteem issues, success fears and a bad habit of quitting. I'm not sure I would simply accept my son being in no sports. Physical activity is a part of healthy life and a parent that simply neglects that isn't a very good parent in my mind. If they dislike football, fine, as Norock (I think) mentioned, then you try something else. You don't simply say "Oh, fine. Go play video games then since you don't like sports." The job of the parent is to push the child, shape the child, put the child in some circumstances that force them to grow, not always just their comfort zone.
-- Posted by norock at 4:13 pm on April 22, 2008
agreed 100% [ha ha, its funny agreeing with your agreement]
-- Posted by Catalyst11 at 4:24 pm on April 22, 2008
Quote: from norock at 7:26 am on April 22, 2008
Quote: from Tavis at 11:19 am on April 20, 2008
I have thought about this long and hard, and even had a class of mine discuss this, and I have made a theory how children are raised, and what is to become of their lives, due to their influences.
this should be interesting
Lets start with the simplest influence, their parents. Think back long and hard about how your parents raised you. Did they make you do things, or was it an option..? Most parents, I feel, are pushing things upon their children at a younger age, which is transforming them into something they might not want to be.
The funny thing is, is that one CANNOT think back long and hard to the times that they were a child, sure some fleeting memories are still there, but thoughts and desires from that time were not stored, they COULD not be at that stage in development. lets read further and see what else becomes of this.
Take the colour of their room for example. You have a son. Most people automatically want that room to be painted blue, to reflect him being a male. This also works with girls and the colour pink, of course. You are assuming that they want this, instead of letting them pick. I think that people should just paint their rooms white, let it be neutral, so the kids can decide once they have that sense of responsibility.
You want a 12 month old baby to decide the color of his or her room?
or do you intend to wait until said child is 2-4 when the first words start coming out and then paint it whatever comes out first:
"boat"
"you see that honey, he said boat"
"yep, lets get some boat wall paper!" thats just silly. or do you want to wait until the child is 6 and can actually make decisions [albeit they are not informed, they are impuslive] and paint it the neon pink and black and red that the child wants? children, during their developmental years need to be shaped [and are consequently shaped by EVERYTHING we do, so that our actions reflect who they become, even the smallest of habits]
The next thing, is what hobbies they are enrolled into. Sure, influencing them to stay active by joining a sport is fine, or playing an instrument, but really, don't choose for them. Although I might be stereotyping a little, most people want their children to play football. However, not all children like it, and only choose that sport to fit in. I suggest leaving all the doors open at all times, to choose what they feel is right. So what if you son or daughter wants to dance, let them. Don't shut doors, or else that might be another career option closed for you son at a younger age.
You are a moron.
5-6 year olds have no clue about the options available to them, and lecturing them as to the basis and how-to of every sport so that they can make a logical, educated decision is a silly notion. parents enroll their kids in sports and hobbies that THEY liked as a kid in hopes that the kid will enjoy them too. It also serves as a way for kids to make new friends as well as learn sociability skills and physical fitness. what BETTER decision would the kid make, whose attention span is no longer than a minute? Of course, if the kid doesn't like it, I don't think one should MAKE them continue, but the parent should enroll them in ANOTHER sport, let the kid try that out and see what happens. Are you under the impression that pre-teens are rational, logical beings? they are developing and have a limited grasp of the world, and need to be shaped. They are impulsive, and need to be pushed into things so that they can experience them for themselves and make opinions on said matters.
Now, the main one I want to focus on is the toys they have. Think about how you have turned out. Most of you didn't have a 'ps2' or '360'. Some of you had a sega or another of those older systems, but except for that, there was no talking toys that make their own story. You were allowed to express yourself in any way possible, using your simple, 4-wheeled toy truck, and little work bench where you would make mud pie galore. The barbies with a home, and that was it. You were given choices on what to do, allowed to let your imagination run wild. Now, you have the barbies that talk, and tell you what to do, you have cars, that actually talk, so there is no need for this imagination.
I do agree with this point, children should be pushed to use their imagination, and develop their own concept of the world around them, and the experiences people face in life. [even if that experience is that of an ambulance "whoosh"ing down the road.]
Also, don't choose who you want your child to be. If he wants to play with barbies, so be it. If she wants to play with trucks, so be it. Let them choose what they want to play with, who they want to play with, what they want to play! I'm not sure, but maybe people will be a lot more accepting in the newest generation, if they are allowed to do what they want.
I don't quite agree with this, Parents should raise their kids as they see fit. I do not see any harm in showing your son that trucks are more fun than barbies. I see where you are going: "if he's going to be gay he's going to be gay" but I don't think that there is a gay gene, I think that children are raised a certain way, and if their internal conception of normalcy and sexual tendency react a certain way with their nurture, then the result is a homosexual. I do not think that a 4 year old will play with barbies because he likes her shoes, or dress. Its imagination, thats all. So why not simply channel that imagination to something more along the lines of a childhood boy, if thats what the kid is. [again, sure if the kid cries about it and wants the barbie back, give it to him, but if he is just as content with the trucks, or the gi joes, whats the harm?]
Finally, I'd also like to point out how violent kids are in the newest generation, the ones going into grade 1 now. I have a little friend who is in grade two, but he is very violent. He tries to beat me up, and always is angry. As are two little girls I know. One rips my hair while the other chokes me. Think of what is happening to our next generation. They are being influnced way to much with violence.
I don't know if this is the nature of television and games today that do this [which most kids usually grow out of when they learn the TRUE concepts of right and wrong], or if it something else entirely, but i DO know that what is the MAJOR cause is the lack of parental strictness. All of these liberal hippy parents think that children should be free to express themselves without being "judged". WRONG! kids need discipline so that they can react smoothly with social norms. kids do not know that flailing their arms wildly in public is wrong if you let them do it because "they are expressing themselves", so they wont see anything wrong with doing it in class, or hitting another kid [who the first kid probably doesn't even care about, since he is not aware that the other kid is like him and sees other people]. Kids are not aware of separate minds and individuals, there is themselves, and the other things around them that move. Mommy is the pretty one, daddy is the strong one, billy is the smelly one, mary is the funny one. But I am the only one really here, they are all just "things" to kids, who don't understand sentience of other beings until early pre-teen years.
The WWE for example. Parents seem more and more lenient to them watching these kinds of things. My parents didn't even allow me to watch Power Rangers, because it was violent, and they don't want violence at a younger age. Also, the video games they play. My older brother, SilverDoor, works at an 'Electronic Boutique Games (EB Games)', and parents don't even care the littlest that they are buying their 7 year old a game where there is swearing, violence, guns, drugs. The key game is Grand theft auto, but there is so many out there, that keep influencing the way children act.
shouldn't you let your kids decide what they want to watch? you let them decide everything else...Or is it that they can make educated decisions about their sports and recreation, but not their leisure? though I do agree less video games and more out door encouragement. you have a misunderstanding as to how well kids understand the world, my friend... edit:
also, white walls reflect light, even at night the room would be bright without the windows blacked out. babies tend to wake more often during the night in white rooms due to the excitability of the reflection. darker colors are much better for babies sleep patterns [even yellows and pinks absorb light and allow the kids to sleep]
what the hell does it matter the color of the room anyway? are you under the impression that your room color made you who you are today? If so, then I maintain that you are a very dull person. If the kid wants to change it later on, sure let him/her change it, but don't leave the wall white because you don't want to infringe upon the 14 year decision making process of your child, come on now.
Well I was about to post this, but norok beat me to it.
-- Posted by Tavis at 4:28 pm on April 22, 2008
Well, we both have our points, I'm not here to really argue, you do make a good point, and most likely we are on the same page, but I just don't express it as well as I'd like. You no doubt make very valid statements, but heck, is anyone really going to listen to what another says about how to raise their children? It of course depends where you live, your traditions, all off of that stuff.
-- Posted by nikki at 8:33 am on April 28, 2008
Quote: from dunebug at 12:08 am on April 23, 2008
I have to say I agree with Norock. Your idea is sweet in theory Tavis, that children should be respected and allowed to make as many decisions as possible. But as someone with a small child, I can tell you that it's just not practical. As Norock mentioned, without any sort of guide children just float aimlessly in life. Few children, especially young children, are self-motivated. Even those that are, lack the life and practical knowledge of how to get involved in sports, activities and things like that. The job of the parent is to guide the child, it's not to force, but pushing your child into sports and not letting them quit every time they have a bad day is what separates a good parent from a lazy one. I have rarely to never seen a healthy, active, happy product from a household where the parent just shrugged every time the kid wanted to flunk out of something, because they wanted to be supportive in their child's "dislike", like you're encouraging. All they ended up with is a child with self-esteem issues, success fears and a bad habit of quitting. I'm not sure I would simply accept my son being in no sports. Physical activity is a part of healthy life and a parent that simply neglects that isn't a very good parent in my mind. If they dislike football, fine, as Norock (I think) mentioned, then you try something else. You don't simply say "Oh, fine. Go play video games then since you don't like sports." The job of the parent is to push the child, shape the child, put the child in some circumstances that force them to grow, not always just their comfort zone.
I agree with this exactly. You simply cannot expect a child to make informed decisions about what they want to do. If they don't like Sport "A", fine, but that doesn't mean that you should just let them not do anything. Get them to try out other activities, otherwise they'll never get the chance to know what they like and dislike.
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